POLANDA : - powered by PolishForums Classifieds [68] Off-Topic [220]
45,620    

Off-Topicpage 1215 of 1521

Random Chat



Lyzko
20 Dec 2018  #36,421

I sometimes wonder whether or not ever since the Patriot Act we here in the good ol' US still have such freedom of expression! If Trump can threaten to sue the NYT for alleged slander or defamation of character, what's next?

TheOther
20 Dec 2018  #36,422

There is no freedom of speech in the UK if you can be arrested for tweeting something that "annoys" another person..

Well, "annoying" is probably not the correct word in this context. "Threatening" is, though.

What do you think about the forum rules then, Maf? If the mods hand out suspensions for "Abuse", "Baiting", "Trolling" or any other childish reason, does that indicate a lack of free speech?

Dirk diggler
20 Dec 2018  #36,423

Freedom of speech doesn't exactly extend to private institutions. That's why you can get fired from a job, suspended or banned from an organization, etc for saying certain things. In the public sphere, yes there is a right to free speech in the us. A person can say just about whatever they want in public. But when they use a 3rd party platform tp say things whether it's twitter youtube or pf you're subject to that organizations/business you're under their rules. On the other hand, you can make your own website and say whatever you want. That's why sites like dailystormer, stormfront, jihadology and numerous other sites exist some promoting far right, some far left, some jihad, just depends.

Unfortunately the right to free speech isn't honored in Europe especially western europe. Uk is arguably the worst offender. It is a well known fact that writing anti migrant statements or even merely citing facts like the majority of child grooming gangs are pakistani muslims will get you fined or arrested. You can't even report on Muslim child groomers trials outside of a courthouse without being arrested.

The communications act is only half of it. The terrorism act has been used to silence anyone who points out uncomfortable facts. People can be "charged" with an "offence" if their actions are within the law but their "reasons for doing it" are perceived as illegal hate by others, London police have said, before withdrawing the claim.

Zero hedge describes it quite well
zerohedge.com/news/2018-03-24/uk-thought-police-detaining-opponents

And very few people here are actually 'far right.' Anyone who wants to preserve the traditional family unit, is conservative and a patriot is now considered far right, nazi, fascist, etc. It's been totally overused and no one in their right mind even listens to it anymore. Anyone to the left of a commie or socialist is called far right, mostly by them. Anytime cnn or some other msm call a person far right most people simply shrug.

mafketis
20 Dec 2018  #36,424

Well, "annoying" is probably not the correct word in this context.

It's the word in the law. It's what they meant or they would have used another word...

legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/21/schedule/17

TheOther
20 Dec 2018  #36,425

It's the word in the law.

If I make fun of someone online, is that considered an annoyance, an inconvenience or do I cause needless anxiety? Who determines what constitutes an annoyance? That law is a toothless tiger as long as it doesn't incorporate a definition of what annoyance, inconvenience or anxiety exactly means. Rights in Britain are, on the whole, implicit. Rather than declaring "You have the right to do something" it is assumed that you do, unless there is a specific reason to stop it.

whether it's twitter youtube or pf you're subject to that organizations/business you're under their rules.

Thank you. Exactly why this BS "protest" performed by some of our resident clowns is such a joke. Don't like it here? Eff off. Simples.

And very few people here are actually 'far right.'

Far too many, and they are the ones who are dragging the whole place down.

Dirk diggler
20 Dec 2018  #36,426

Well this is a 'polish forum' and judging by the EU's and numerous msm outlets the Polish government and it's voters as well as those participating in Independence day marches are 'far right.' If that's the case so be it. People can throw whatever adjectives and labels they want. At the end of the day the majority of poles don't want to take in third world migrants, don't want gay marraige, and want their polish christian culture and traditions preserved. If that makes us far right whatever. We'd rather have that label than be 'progressive' and deal with Islamic terror and be replaced by non poles in our own country or capital like the way many other w europeans countries either already are or will be very soon.

TheOther
20 Dec 2018  #36,427

If that makes us far right whatever.

Generally speaking, there are patriots and then there are rabid nationalists who use PF to spread their political agenda. I'm fine with the first, but oppose the latter. The beauty of free speech.

Dirk diggler
20 Dec 2018  #36,428

Indeed. Problem is being patriotic is being equated more and more with being fascist, nazi, etc by pro globalist leftists and msm and many people who are too lazy to think for themselves buy it. Nationalism isn't even inherently bad. Nationalism is what caused ww2, but also what caused the Soviet Union to collapse. It united Americans after pearl Harbor and 911. It launched the european spring in 1848 and the more recent arab spring. It toppled monarchies and replaced them with democracies and republics. It isn't nationalism that's bad, nationalism is literally defined as patriotism, advocacy of independence, extreme love for your country, etc. It depends how nationalism is used that can be good or bad. Saying nationalism is bad or evil is like saying democracy or socialism or even love is inherently bad when there's so many other variables that come into play depending on how it's used.

Dirk diggler
20 Dec 2018  #36,429

Czar Putin I speaks the truth re trump and brexit

bbc.com/news/amp/world-europe-46630723

Preach!

delphiandomine
20 Dec 2018  #36,430

There is no freedom of speech in the UK if you can be arrested for tweeting something that "annoys" another person...

To be fair, the same happens in Poland if you simply say in public that you're "pissed off" with something.

mafketis
21 Dec 2018  #36,431

Who determines what constitutes an annoyance? That law is a toothless tiger

This type of law (that can applied to virtually everyone) is usually subject to selective enforcement to punish people that cannot be found guilty of other infractions.

mafketis
21 Dec 2018  #36,432

Rights in Britain are, on the whole, implicit

In other words, they don't exist.

In other news, English police don't want to hear about your house being burgled...

telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/11770814/If-the-police-wont-investigate-a-burglary-what-is-the-point-of-them.html

But say mean things about muslims on a train and they're interested...

yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/officers-investigating-hate-crime-search-for-loud-man-who-talked-of-dislike-of-muslims-on-train-from-york-to-leeds-1-9501825?fbclid=IwAR3hSFYez_Hk4owiL3FnycVKkBPI_gN3mp3rLk6fuE7wYaMWkteyfBpFkLI

Welcome to the post nation state!

Dirk diggler
21 Dec 2018  #36,433

And people argue there's free speech in the public sphere in uk....

The guy should've said that the burglars called him a racial epiteth then the cops would be all over it.

Don't forget about the grooming gang scandals where the police and social services refused to investigate due to PC and fear of being called racist. 10 years 1400 kids in Rotterham alone....

Jesus so merely talking loudly about dislike of muslims is a hate crime that's just insane. There wasn't even threats let alone violence involved. If only they went after jihadis and the extremist mosques this hard. This is why I say that no form of brexit or lack thereof will repair this lunacy in british society. Yet choudrys can walk around with uk go to hell signs and say bad things about non muslims and it's not a hate crime?

I'm guessing the British police use a skin color classification system when it comes to speech being a hate crime or not.

Lyzko
21 Dec 2018  #36,434

I return to the immortal words of a once-famous philosopher, " I disagree with everything you've said, but will defend unto my death your right to say it."

King Donald The Perfect might want to consider those words:-)

Dirk diggler
21 Dec 2018  #36,435

The worst thing is criticizing a vibrant cultural enricher or reporting on a trial such as this guy may get you fined or arrested. Idk what's worse the group of Moroccan teens who gang raped a donkey or this

google.com/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/burglar-sex-corpse-funeral-home-birmingham-coffins-kasim-khuram-a8691776.html%3famp

Sylvio
21 Dec 2018  #36,436

Merged:

Gatwick drones are Santas



Last year we had North Korea threatening 3rd world war, this year its drones. Anything is good to spoil peoples turkey. Why? Because its to do Jesus birthday, and... Aaaaaaah!!!! people could be singing carols again, right? throwing us satanists into frothy convulsions..!

TheOther
22 Dec 2018  #36,437

This type of law ... is usually subject to selective enforcement to punish people that cannot be found guilty of other infractions.

How often does that happen? Any numbers?

Kabila
22 Dec 2018  #36,438

Me Dr. Kabila. Me seeks job Poland. Me PHD Economics and Business Harvard University. Me fom Uganda. Speak 20 languages. Very good Resume and qualifications. Call me for interwiew.

Warm regards,
Dr. Kabila

mafketis
22 Dec 2018  #36,439

Any numbers?

Nah, governments usually don't keep statistics on things like selective enforcement. But the dankula case is one pretty awful example, how many state resources were flushed down the toilet there?

Joker
22 Dec 2018  #36,440

Bleach helps. Otherwise burial in clean earth.

Just like God has judged the homosexual

jon357
22 Dec 2018  #36,441

God

Which one?

johnny reb
22 Dec 2018  #36,442

(hint) the One that you will be celebrating His birthday in three days from now.
The One that practicing homosexuals are in denial of because of His teachings of how practicing homosexuals will not inherit the Kingdom of Heaven.
This has been explained endlessly here before in detail. Zzzzzzz

TheOther
22 Dec 2018  #36,443

Nah, governments usually don't keep statistics on things like selective enforcement.

I asked because I wondered who and how many are really sentenced under that law to constitute a suppression of free speech. Is it just a handful of people each year who are mostly members of the National Front/ BNP, or is it thousands of people from all walks of life?

Dirk diggler
23 Dec 2018  #36,444

it just a handful of people each year who are mostly members of the National Front/ BNP, or is it thousands of people from all walks of life?

Several hundred I'd say, but likely that number is far higher because in many cases the cops just come and talk to the person try to ascertain whether he or she is a danger to the public, and also try to convince them to embrace multiculturalism. There's of course numerous people that were banned from speaking in public and entering the country, fined for displaying certain signs flags etc i.e. one guy fined hundreds of pounds for posting a picture with a Nazi flag, soldiers were fired merely for standing next to tommy robinson in a picture, all sorts of ****...

One guy recorded the whole encounter with the british thought crime cops and they wanted him to go meet an imam to better understand islam lololol.

youtube.com/watch?v=TS6DzWF-cow

Chemikiem
23 Dec 2018  #36,445

There is no freedom of speech in the UK if you can be arrested for tweeting something that "annoys" another person...

I think there is some confusion here. As far as I can ascertain, that part of the 2003 Communications Act refers to the making of silent telephone calls.

" It was declared an offence to "persistently make use of a public electronic communications network for the purpose of causing annoyance, inconvenience or needless anxiety". Ofcom subsequently developed policies to reduce the number of silent telephone calls."

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communications_Act_2003

What the TheOther is asking about refers to Section 127 of that act, malicious communications.

" Section 127 of the act makes it an offence to send a message that is grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character over a public electronic communications network.[9] The section replaced section 43 of the Telecommunications Act 1984 and is drafted as widely as its predecessor.[10] The section has been used controversially to prosecute users of social media in cases such as the Twitter Joke Trial and Facebook comments concerning the murder of April Jones.[11]".

I wondered who and how many are really sentenced under that law to constitute a suppression of free speech

More than I thought there would be, but IMO, if you're a normal, well-balanced person who isn't a troll sending malicious and nasty messages online, you more than likely have nothing to fear ;-)

Have a read of this:

telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/11627180/Five-internet-trolls-a-day-convicted-in-UK-as-figures-show-ten-fold-increase.html

TheOther
23 Dec 2018  #36,446

Interesting. Who decides what material should be considered "grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character"? Most people have their own ideas about that.

Dirk diggler
23 Dec 2018  #36,447

That law combined with the anti-terror law is what 'thought crime' and its enforcement is all about.

delphiandomine
23 Dec 2018  #36,448

Interesting. Who decides what material should be considered "grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character"?

Talking about English law here - indecency and obscenity is defined here - cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/obscene-publications

Menacing - scl.org/articles/2579-section-127-of-the-communications-act-2003-threat-or-menace - there's quite a lot on the subject. It's a legislative mess, but that's normal for English law.

I asked because I wondered who and how many are really sentenced under that law to constitute a suppression of free speech.

The thing is that there's no such thing as freedom of speech in Europe and never has been. Let's take the Czechs as a good example - they guarantee freedom of speech, *but* with many exceptions that ban things, including "denigration of a nation, race, ethnic or other group of people (Article 355 of the Criminal Code), i.e. hate speech,", as well as "public display of sympathy towards a movement oriented at curbing rights of the people (Article 404 of the Criminal Code), e.g. propagation of hate-groups,".

And of course, Poland has one of Europe's worst and vague laws when it comes to "insulting" others, with people prosecuted for merely swearing in public.

Dirk diggler
23 Dec 2018  #36,449

Yes but the difference is the level of enforcement. People aren't fined and arrested for speech violations in e europe as in w europe especially uk. Most of the Polish and czech laws are enforced when someone disparages poles, the Catholic church, or more recently says poles were responsible for the holocaust although that's been amended to an extent. If someone says something about muslims or portrays migrants in a bad light in poland no one's going to be arrested or fined. Hell even the ministry of foreign affairs released an anti migrant video. If the producer was british and posted such a video on a british server they'd definitely face a fine or arrest.

delphiandomine
24 Dec 2018  #36,450

People aren't fined and arrested for speech violations in e europe

They aren't?

poznan.wyborcza.pl/poznan/7,36001,23013402,joanna-jaskowiak-jednak-odpowie-za-slowa-jestem-wkurwiona.html- prosecuted for saying "I'm pissed off" in public.

Or perhaps you'll prefer this one: facebook.com/notesfrompoland/posts/polands-anti-free-speech-laws-strike-again-a-satirist-who-wrote-that-poland-is-a/1035535503288326/ - prosecuted for saying that Poland is a stupid, narrow-minded country.

Or maybe you'll like the idea of someone being prosecuted for saying kurwa - facebook.com/notesfrompoland/posts/1100940123414530 ?

There's really no difference. Both Western and Eastern Europe use these laws to suppress freedom of speech.


PreviousNext
What medication would you take if you had HIV-Aids? Curious? [11]Tour agencies from Poland interested in Serbia [30]


Off-Topic / Random Chattop