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Macron insults The USA.



Miloslaw
6 Nov 2018  #1

Macron's anti American speech about a European army defending Europe against many enemies included The USA......was disgusting......
He is losing support and popularity and is playing up to French anti americanism.
But in the week leading up to November 11th,it is doubly disgusting.
The USA saved France,not once,but twice in the twentieth century.
I spend a lot of time in France and have seen many cemeteries full of American graves......
His comments are disgusting and I hope The Yanks punish him for it.

delphiandomine
6 Nov 2018  #2

Macron's anti American speech about a European army defending Europe against many enemies included The USA......was disgusting......

Why? Trump is no friend of Europe, and do you think there's any support in the US for American soldiers to die on the fields of Europe?

Bratwurst Boy
6 Nov 2018  #3

Macron's anti American speech about a European army defending Europe

Imagine that Milo, a Europe which is no longer dependent on the US to defend itself, no more that massive drain on US taxpayers monies! YAY!!! :)

Miloslaw
6 Nov 2018  #4

I'm sure The Yanks will be very pleased to absolve themselves of the responsibility,financial expense and expense in lives in defending Europe from itself.....but do you really trust a European army run by unelected beaureucrats to defend Europe?

They would be marching in to Poland,Hungary,Italy and Greece now to impose their will......is that what you want?

Bratwurst Boy
6 Nov 2018  #5

Of course this army needs polish, hungarian, italian and greek troops and equipment too...it will be their own troops in their own countries which will do the marching...

But it also means that, should the **** hit the fan, it never will be polish troops alone against an overwhelming enemy. Chances are even rising that said enemy will never dare again to attack.

delphiandomine
6 Nov 2018  #6

but do you really trust a European army run by unelected beaureucrats to defend Europe?

Hence why it should be a real and integrated military alliance. The current situation where national armies mostly sit in their home countries is just nonsense and doesn't lend itself to European defence.

Miloslaw
6 Nov 2018  #7

By your post,I assume that you would not trust a European army at present.

delphiandomine
6 Nov 2018  #8

Not at present, no. We have a problem in that there's no common Schengen border guard, and it's what led to the migrant crisis in the first place as Greece (and Italy) were absolutely unwilling to allow others to help patrol the seas. There's some limited national cooperation - for example, Poles and Germans patrol and work together - but it would be far better for everyone if we had a single border guard so that resources could be quickly deployed to where they're needed.

It might surprise you, but I want a rock-solid external Schengen border. No-one should be able to cross it (except at legal border crossings) without being detected and detained, IMO.

A common European army would just have the same problems. Too many squabbling, too much interference from politicians and not enough defence. NATO actually works well, because the Americans coordinate things while the Europeans just provide what's needed.

Miloslaw
6 Nov 2018  #9

Agreed Delph.

Rich Mazur
6 Nov 2018  #10

Too many squabbling, too much interference from politicians and not enough defense.

...and the insane politically correct rules of engagement.
That EU army would never be able to win WW2 just as the US army is clueless how to win in Afghanistan. It's hard to do it when the guys are told that they are cops and social workers rolled into one and that their mission is to "win hearts and minds" instead of "kill and destroy".

Plus, one dead kid as a collateral damage and everything would have to stop, the case investigated, and the accused tried in some goofy international court of something. Which would take five years, twenty five lawyers, and I am probably lowballing.

Bratwurst Boy
7 Nov 2018  #11

Plus, one dead kid as a collateral damage

Since it would be purely a defense force it would be OUR dead kids...a good reason to make a warrior out of any naive social worker! (I hope)

Rich Mazur
7 Nov 2018  #12

Since it would be purely a defense force it would be OUR dead kids...

A purely defensive force is doomed. You can't win that way. Fight-to-win wars have more than the repel phase. The final phase is kill all-you-can to leave a lasting impression. That's what the US did in Japan.

Bratwurst Boy
7 Nov 2018  #13

Well...Japan stupidly attacked the US in the Pacific...and the US reacted...a defense move, see?

Joker
7 Nov 2018  #14

really trust a European army run by unelected beaureucrats to defend Europe?

Being that both World Wars were started by the Europeans and their evil armies???

There are too many countries in Europe that dont like and trust trust each other, ask Crow, he could be your General!! LOL

Rich Mazur
7 Nov 2018  #15

.and the US reacted...a defense move, see?

My point is that today WW2 would be impossible to win for all the touchy-feely, politically correct reasons that were not a consideration 75 years ago. Today, the western armies are police and social workers with more restrictions that cops in Chicago. Like that they have to be fired upon before shooting back. Being unpleasant to the enemy will get you in trouble. When the locals rape, our guys are not allowed to react the way any normal cop back home would.

Joker
7 Nov 2018  #16

Obama really defined what is was to have PC Army and the world walked all over us.

A purely defensive force is doomed.

The only victory would be against a PC Army

We have a problem in that there's no common Schengen border guard, and it's what led to the migrant crisis in the first place

Hey, we do have something in common!

I would love to have a border for my country, just makes sense, everyone else has one.

Lyzko
7 Nov 2018  #17

I didn't even hear the speech, but undoubtedly, he was only being sarcastic.

Voltaire too tried to denigrate the English language, well aware of Shakespeare etc., but was taking the characteristic pot shot at the English.
Same here no doubt with Macron and the Americans. As I understood things, his last meeting with Trump was overwhelmingly positive.
A damned sight better than was the case with Merkel, supposedly a staunch ally of the States (though not of TrumpLOL)

Miloslaw
7 Nov 2018  #18

The French really don't like Americans in general,despite the fact that they saved them fromThe Germans......who they also despise....fact is that The French live in a delusional world in which they think they are superior to everyone in every aspect....they think they run Europe,because they control the dumb "Bosch"......it's funny,ridiculous and sad all at the same time.....but their Muslim problem will come back to bite them on the bum harder than any other European country,with the possible exception of Belgium,because of the numbers they have allowed in and the way they have treated them.....ditto Belgium.France will be the first to fall....

TheOther
8 Nov 2018  #19

The French really don't like Americans ... The Germans......who they also despise

What gives you these silly ideas? Bad experience with a waiter in Paris?

Lyzko
8 Nov 2018  #20

No, TheOther!

Historically, there's always been a rivalry between the two nations ever since Thomas A' Beckett was murdered in around the 12th century, the relations between Normans and Saxons, later France and England, haven't been especially cordial.

What passes as rudeness is really a sort of world-weary arrogance coupled with a degree of jealousy that countries such as the US. far less culturally developed than France, are so much more industrially successful, despite a low standard of living here in the States compared with other industrial nations.

Bratwurst Boy
8 Nov 2018  #21

What I'm saying! All that "disliking" and "hating" is nothing else than badly hidden JEALOUSY!

Rich Mazur
8 Nov 2018  #22

Couldn't state it any better.

Lyzko
8 Nov 2018  #23

And Germany as well as the US don't have a twinge of jealousy as well?

Bratwurst Boy
8 Nov 2018  #24

Only the lefties hate the US...as the capitalist arch enemy to the communist morning dawn, not necessarily because of jealousy.

Most Germans adore and respect the US generally, always had and still do...even if the wish to immigrate there and live there has sunk in recent time. As living in Germany is now widely seen as safer and more comfy for the common man (and woman). The rosy image of the US took quite a beating...

And I don't think any USian is jealous of any not-USian! :)

Rich Mazur
8 Nov 2018  #25

Most Germans adore and respect the US generally, always had and still do...

Those are kind words and I appreciate them.
I will only add that, in the history of mankind, no other country ever treated their war opponents better and with more generosity that the US did its ex-enemies after 1945. This makes the US a very special place.

Lyzko
8 Nov 2018  #26

Bratwurst Boy, quit sucking up to Trumpist-croniest capitalism!

Oh, I realize that growing up in any sort of dictatorship, Nazism or Communism, can warp one's personality, don't deny the simple fact that under FDR's New Deal, the US was the most prosperous, (heaven forbid!!), materially happiest, and about the most productive nation on earth.

These aren't massaged statistics either, my friend, just read the history, watch the movies from that immediate post-War era, and then you'd realize the deep nostalgia for that period.

Bratwurst Boy
8 Nov 2018  #27

....did not!

dolnoslask
8 Nov 2018  #28

growing up in any sort of dictatorship, Nazism or Communism FDR's New Deal

Yep it was FDR's new deal at Yalta to sell out millions of people to communist dictatorship.

I'm glad that you feel, that you and America prospered under his rule.

Whats wrong with capitalism you have prospered under it, while millions of others suffered under communism.

Yeah there is plenty of nostalgia for FDR here in Poland come and soak it up.

Rich Mazur
8 Nov 2018  #29

Yep it was FDR's new deal at Yalta to sell out millions of people to communist dictatorship.

Those are typical Polish talking points.
The US didn't sell anything. You can't sell what you don't own. The Soviet army was already in Eastern Europe. What did you expect the US to do? Go to war with them over Poland? After all that hell the US went through with Germany and Japan? No, thanks.

Tacitus
8 Nov 2018  #30

Yep it was FDR's new deal at Yalta to sell out millions of people to communist dictatorship.

It is not like he had a choice in this matter


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