Poland`s aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 3

And yet every country if given the choice, wants to be part of the US hegemony instead of Russia's sphere of influence. Ever wondered why?

Because RuSSia`s sphere mean the rule of KGB gangsters instead of the rule of law. Plus corruption, underdevelopment, poverty and sick obsessions about empire.

Some classic whataboutism. What has Russia to do with the subjects I raised? This is a thread about "Polish Aid to Ukraine". Poland is assisting Ukraine with funds and weapons, employing a specific calculus that involves heavy reliance on US security guarantees and the overall framework of the NATO alliance. I'm sure that in the context of the current war, Poland's actions are indeed pleasing to the US. However, if Poland expects this solidarity to be reciprocated at some future point, it would be very foolish to do so, as historical precedent demonstrates that America has a short memory, and volatile shifts in policy.

To still answer your question, however, it's because of $$$. Shielded by two oceans, untouched by war and by history, blessed with abundant resources - America is a giant of wealth. The deepest, most liquid capital markets, and the richest consumer market in the world - will make other players do near anything to maintain good relations with such a country. Russia, if you hadn't noticed, had a pretty rough century - where most of its wealth was lost, and it's people scattered.

Russia is the very reason why everybody wants to be part of US hegemony. You can ridicule American conduct as much as you want, yet it is nothing to how Russia behaves.

You insist on discussing Russia it seems... Russia is consistent in defending its allies - whether at the UN Security Council (ask China), or in the arena of economics (ask Venezuela, Cuba), or when it comes to hot conflict (Syria, Angola, Vietnam, Ethiopia, Egypt, etc). Ukraine was no ally to us, having left the CIS, never having joined the ODKB (Russia-led security bloc), Eurasian Customs Union, or any other allied framework. The only thing they seem to be able to wave in our face is the Budapest Memorandum (key word: Memorandum).

On another note, I'm glad you do not disagree with my characterization of American duplicity in regards to Britain and France.

In case of Poland? Everything.


You see, Tacitus, Bobko thinks it's all about money :))


Yeah, even from their own people, like in Kazachstan or Syria lol Btw, did you notice that RuSSia's allies tend to be not very democratic? 🤔 Why do you think is that?

No, it's all about democracy and basic respect for human dignity - this is why the whole world and their mother want to do business with China. Right?

Perhaps the world wants to work with America, DESPITE Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo, Black Sites, engineered revolutions, weddings bombed from UAVs, war criminal soldiers let off by American military tribunals, etc, etc?


No, but I noticed that our Allies tend to be smaller, weaker countries that the US tried to bulldoze into the ground for daring to have an independent view. Poor Cuba has been under sanctions for 60 years, and suffered one failed US invasion as well as dozens of assassination attempts against its leaders. Venezuela, was shut out from the entire world economy by the US, in part for assisting Cuba with energy supplies, plunging its population into abject poverty. Vietnam, was nearly erased from the face of the planet in the worst bombing campaigns since WW2, and so on and so forth.

Against their own people. Just like the Warsaw pact was the only defence alliance in history that exclusively intervened against their own member states. At least the Americans did not march on Paris when De Gaulle decided to leave NATO.

The achievements of the USA include the defense of preservation of freedom and democracy in Europe,Japan and South Korea. All Russia has to show for is the preservation of regimes in Cuba and Venezuela. And now of course waging a genocidal war of agression in Europe.


You mean like Russia planned to so with Ukraine?

Ah, business - yes. Alliance? No.
Poland was doing business with RuSSia too. Alliance? No.


You must be blind then :)))

Also we can point to the fact that we helped decolonize half of Africa (for which they are still grateful - ask a Ugandan or Angolan), helped kick the British and French out of the Middle East - permanently, and decolonized Southeast Asia, as well.

Also, we can point to the fact that we lifted hundreds of millions of Chinese out of poverty and illiteracy through our systemic aid throughout the 40s, 50s, and 60s until relations went to hell because the new Soviet leaders weren't Stalinist enough for Mao.

Stick to the subject of the thread please

Remember all those times Russian posters bragged about the imminent encirclement of Ukrainian forces in Donbas? Looks like something like that may have happened - however the ones being encircled are Russian Units.

google.com/amp/s/news.yahoo.com/amphtml/russian-propagandist-confirms-encirclement-russian-113900685.html

And both here on PF and with the Glavset trolls on newspaper comments fora the script has changed. Trying to distract and talking about global p9litics.

Twitter is really going wild with videos of captured or killed Russian soldiers. Among those captured is allegedly a Lieutenant Colonel.

We will have to wait and see how this turns out, but this might really become a significant defeat for the Russian army.

@Bobko
You know how Venezuela was able to eliminate children starving to death in hospitals? The government made it a criminal act for a doctor to put starvation as a cause of death on the death certificate. This is the kind of country Russia aligns itself with. The $hit hole countries. Imagine Putin doing that in Russia, and how easily he could do it, and then you have the level of civilization in Russia and its allies.

These are easy and obvious reasons for people to want democracy. Like Ukraine. The US is certain imperfect, but it is certainly a 100% better option than what Russia and its friends offer.

Nobody will be surprised if it will end that way as it is psychologically tough to be the invader who is ordered to kill his ex-brothers. At least they wouldn't spend 20 years to get to that point.

Poor invaders! They suffer such psychological traumas. hahahahaha Do you expect us to start crying now over their pitiful plight????


ends, not will end.

poor babies!

Oh, Russian soldiers have shown their eagerness to kill Ukrainians, as long as they are unarmed civilians like in Bucha. Once those Ukrainians start shooting back however... .

You are so right. PTSD was invented in a Russian lab in Novosibirsk. I know because I was part of that program.

They made their bed and can lie in it.


They're using the combined artillery techniques they trained on in Britain, Ironically on Salisbury Plain...

And just wait until the planes arrive for the Ukrainian Air Force. The r*SSian troops had better start removing the red and blue from their flags.


If it ends. Pre-intermediate mistake.

PARIS (AP) - Breaking the rules by taking a deep drag of his cigarette in a Paris airport washroom, the fugitive paratrooper rips his Russian passport in two and tosses it in the toilet, along with his military ID.

Russian paratrooper Pavel Filatiev speaks during an interview in Paris on Tuesday, Sept. 6, 2022, after publishing a journal about his experience fighting in Ukraine.
It is Pavel Filatiev's last act of defiance before turning his back on his country forever.


How diminishing.
Same kind of mistake that you make in your second language Polish.
I hate hypocrites.

Please focus on the posts, and not the posters

Just watched a video which showed Ukrainians advancing near Kharkiv. You could watch them passing by tanks donated by Poland and two PzH2000s from Germany/Netherlands. Happy to see that they putting our assistence to good use.

A protest in Cologne, Germany against sanctions and to resume energy ties with Russia
> youtube.com/watch?v=BUaBBSsOluI

After Prague, Cologne Massive demonstration in Germany against Olaf Scholz's government
> youtube.com/watch?v=fH0UTEsaYKs

Berliners Protest for Lifting Sanctions on Russia As Energy Prices Soar
> youtube.com/watch?v=SvBzTcTnQdU

Poland is wise. How good that Poland didn`t already enter war against Russia. Poland would find itself at war, while rest of NATO Europe enters in pro-Russia protests.

Time to think Poles. Defeat of nazism in Ukraine is actually good for Poland.

No, you call P and explain to him why he is a moron.

Which is why Poland is supporting Ukraine in its' struggle against facist Russia.

An agreement on the delivery of 339 Russian-made aircraft was signed at the Eastern Economic Forum

The agreement provides for the delivery of 210 MS-21, 89 SSJ-NEW aircraft and 40 Tu-214 aircraft to Aeroflot Group on leasing terms from 2023 to 2030. The amount of the agreement is more than RUB 1 trillion.

So, couple of years of strong headache for Russian Airlines. Then loss of Russian market for Boeing/Airbus, forever. Plus one more strong competitor on some emerging markets.

Most other problems you noted is already addressed. Starting from sugar beets seeds that was imported from Germany in the past, to SIM card chips. Same story - year or two of headache, then loss of Russian market for EU/US exporters forever. ;)

hahahahaha you said?

So basically Russia hopes that it can rely on inferior yet more expensive domestic products. Good luck. Not like Russia never had any bad experience with this strategy.

@Velund
The key phrase is "Russian made aircraft". When the Russian aircraft industry is considered to be ten years behind Boeing/Airbus, you really are not bragging about anything. The industry itself is only predicted to produce 350 planes by end of this decade. So this information is neither new or impactful. The production information for Russia was available 4 years ago, and the quality information is available as recently as late last year.

Boeing/Airbus not selling to Russia is not unusual. The airlines using their planes typically lease the planes, or buy them on term. Demand for Boeing/Airbus products exceeds supply and Russia means nothing to their business model. Nice try though.

Meanwhile, in the real world, not the imaginary one Velund lives in, Ukraine has been taking back more villages daily. Recapturing more occupied territory daily. Killing more Russian's ever day on Ukraine soil. And in short time it will be Russians that are surrounded like those Ukraine fighters were in Mariupol. I wonder how much mercy will be shown to them by Ukraine. Personally I hope they show none, but I believe they will show that they are the more civilized nation and will follow the rules of war.

And as if the Russian POS have not done enough to united Europe, Switzerland has not come out and publicly said that they will see to make closer ties with NATO over this war. The Swiss! The Orc's have motivated the Fing Swiss to get closer to NATO. LMFAO Putin could have never predicted that. What a bunch of morons.

Interesting film (with translation in tweets)

Ukrainian soldiers ask russian pow's what the fkkk they came to Ukraine for... they don't even sound as angry as they are confused... the russians simply stare into space, dumbfounded....

They're lucky that the Ukrainians follow geneva protocols unlike the orcs who like to torture their prisoners of war...

Ukraine = normal country, filled with patriotic citizens

russia = inferior pseudo-country in which dazed and confused serfs fight and die at the pleasure of the tsar....

twitter.com/Samizdat24/status/1567562249635598337

Russian made aircraft will be the clearest signal possible that Putin has taken you back to the chaos of the 90s - when a simple business trip meant dicing with death in some rattling sprat can, enjoying the smoke from your fellow passengers

As for competing abroad so you think anyone would be nuts enough to buy one of those LOL

Can't wait for the Russian SIM cards - of course they will be totally secure, not modified to track you or invade your privacy and as always in Russia will be 100 percent reliable and never let you down when you are stuck in a snowdrift