American Political News in relation to Poland

It was decided by Trump, he doesn't want to play that game anymore.

Why dont you donate your money to help the Germans or better yet, move to Germany?


Not much of a surprise at all, just look at any number of his troll threads and most of them are anti Polish or American. 16K posts of total rubbish!


Trump has really exposed to the world what deadbeats the Germans have become. If they dont want to pay for their own defense neither should the rest of us. Its only fair!

Even Estonia can meet its obligations, but not the Germs? Screw that 2024 noise as well. You have to pay to play or your membership is suspended. Verstehen du?

I don't think I would lecture a graduate engineer on engineering.

Poland is 20x smaller than the US economy. This year so far it has a trade deficit circa 1.8 bn dollars for the first 6 months. It is not keeping me awake at night and I certainly don't think the answer is tariffs.

I'm sorry you don't follow the news, but this is a well documented and well known trick in NATO. Poland always budgets significantly more than it actually spends on defence, which is why no-one takes the 2% seriously because it simply isn't true.

If I tell you that I'm going to spend 2% on something, but then actually spend 1.6 or 1.7%, am I spending 2%?

Either way, we're doing just fine watching Americans pay for everythng.

Until President Trump came along and showed the E.U. that Socialism doesn't work as the other guys (U.S.A.) money just ran out.

So better change that we're with were.
Poland met their obligation to NATO by paying 2%.
Here's a breakdown of each country's contribution, based on 2016 figures provided by NATO which is why Trump called Merkel out with Germany coming in 16th mooching and then pumping in over $17 BILLION Euro's into Russia's economy by buying 75% of Germany's gas from Russia the country NATO is defending against.

Reality Check !

United States, 3.61%.
Greece, 2.38%.
Britain, 2.21%.
Estonia, 2.16%.
Poland, 2%.
France, 1.78%.
Turkey, 1.56%.
Norway, 1.54%.
Lithuania, 1.49%.
Romania, 1.48%.
Latvia, 1.45%.
Portugal, 1.38%.
Bulgaria, 1.35%.
Croatia, 1.23%.
Albania, 1.21%.
Germany, 1.19%.
Denmark, 1.17%.
Netherlands, 1.17%.
Slovakia, 1.16%.
Italy, 1.11%.
Czech Republic, 1.04%.
Hungary, 1.01%.
Canada, 0.99%.
Slovenia, 0.94%.
Spain, 0.91%.
Belgium, 0.85%.
Luxembourg, 0.44%.
Scotland, 0.0%
And now Trump is calling for bumping up that 2% to 4% so tighten your belts a little more E.U.
Freedom is not Free.

Do you think Germany is a socialist country? If so then it would show socialism can be extremely successful, don't you think?

Military spending of NATO countries and estimated share of GDP in 2017 (in US Dollar):

United States................685,957 ..........3,6%
UK .................................55,237........... 2,1%
France ...........................45,927............1,8%
Germany.........................45,472............1,2%

That's the big Four of NATO, that hacking on about Germany has alot of reasons, but none of them militarily..it just makes no sense!

forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2018/07/10/defense-expenditure-of-nato-members-visualized-infographic/#5752925114cf

In this Forbes list only few countries besides the US and the UK meet the 2 percent (Poland, Greece and Estonia). And all of them contribute much, much less than Germany. But Germany is singled out, the same way as with it's trade or it's gas dependencies.

There is something else going on, something which has nothing to do with the "two percent" at all....Trump seems to see Germany as his main economical rival, this treatment makes no sense otherwise!

Hence I doubt Germany achieving the 2 percent would change a thing...

PS: Maybe Putin asked him to put the screws on Germany???

I wouldn't put it past him now, I don't trust Trump at all....

Germany 1.19%


Germany 1.20%
WoW !
What a HUGE increase from 2016 to 2017 and STILL well short of the 2% Poland is paying.


SINGLED OUT ! lol
While our allie Germany is currently in the process of building a second DIRECT gas pipeline to import gas from Russia, a potential enemy, (With Russia selling it to Germany at a cheaper price than what Russia sells it to the rest of the E.U. for), Poland has plans to build a gas pipeline to supply Poland from the North Sea is hoped to be constructed around 2023 to wean itself off Russia's strangle hold and start supporting it's NATO allies instead of supporting the country NATO is protecting them from by pumping up Russia's economy with BILLIONS from gas exports like Germany is doing.

You still refuse to get it don't you.

I say Germany should keep to the numbers as they are and observe what Trump will do next....

He has anything cooking up on this orange head of his...and it isn't about the security of his former allies as he couldn't give a ****!

Some people here in Poland say that the Polish army is strong on paper only. I am no expert, but the fact that the Polish navy is on the verge of disintegration seems to have almost become common knowledge in Poland. We are going to buy the two 26-year-old warships from Australia very soon (frigates "Adelaide"; the Australians are going to replace them with frigates "Hunter") which purchase the 'defence24' web portal's experts judge to be evidently wrong. If anyone wishes to know more, they can google-translate the following article:

defence24.pl/zamiast-nowych-okretow--wakacje-na-antypodach-opinia

Can't we buy something more modern from the US or from Germany?

Aree you thick or did you not read the link to the NATO documents which shows what WAS spent by county from 2014 to 2017.

You get that these numbers are self-reported and based on national budgets, right?

You don't think NATO would know if Poland was cooking the books ?

Interesting question...how would they know?

Germany could report next year 2,1%! :)

I think they call it the best intelligence in the world next to Israel.

And still Trump doesn't believe them...denigrates them in front of the KGB...

No really, if it's really all about "self reported", how should they know...especially such low numbers after the comma?

I already told you, "Intel".
Those satellites up there can read a newspaper and hear a pin drop.
Nobody can fool nobody anymore.

Us military knows exactly what every country has or doesn't have. If you claim you spent an extra few bil and there's no tanks planes or ships to prove it obviously they're gonna call your bullshit

Sure, they can read a message next year in the SPIEGEL...Germany want's to shuck out money for the army in the next budget anyhow...nothing works there anymore.

That's it! :)

Do they know about the Brits cooking their books?

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3550904/Defence-spending-includes-foreign-aid-pensions-Ministers-accused-fiddling-books-ensure-Britain-met-Nato-target.html

ROFLMAO

We Germans are just to honest...

Probably, but they are also aware of the fact that no one in Europe really wants a strong Germany with a military budget that would be larger than Russia's. Trump doesn't understand that.

What has that got to do with Germany paying their fair share to support NATO who protects their sorry asses.

It is impossible for any Trump supporter to understand that most people don't want the German army to have thousands more tanks - he sees everything in terms of a deal and being either in the money or out of the money. He cannot understand any forms of nuance,

Poland just missed the 2 percent target for 2017 - it was 1,99 percent and will be 1,95 percent for 2018. In fact since 2001 when they started measuring it has achieved 2 percent on only 2 occasions. - the last one in 2016 by buying a few extra planes to fly PiS puppets back to their home towns at the weekend.

New equipment is only 23 percent of the Polish defense budget. So it would be pretty difficult to assess the true figures. Personally I believe the goats numbers as their fiscal reporting is normally quite good and it's one of the few things PiS have not decided to staff with farmers and small town lawyers.

It has nothing to do with Germany having more tanks.
In fact tanks would be worthless and cause a bottle neck in Germany because the rusted out old bridges in Germany could not support the tanks weight.

It's about paying their fair share into NATO.

So what would work ? Nukes ? Paratroops ? You are a Polish patriot and you want them to have a bigger army ?

Do you understand this money is not paid into a big NATO bank account ?

For the umpteenth time: the 2% GDP have absolutely nothing to do with paying "a fair share" into NATO. The Wales Summit Declaration stated that "members should meet the NATO guideline to spend a minimum of 2% of their Gross Domestic Product (GDP) on defense". On their own defense, not on NATO!


Trump was too stupid to understand how NATO works and his followers (see post #505) are obviously, too.

For the umpteenth time, YES, to spend on defense to support NATO ! Grrrrrr
Trump and his followers are not the stupid ones that are full of hate and like to argue for the sake of arguing.
That would be the "I hate trump no matter what" side that refuses to accept what is best to keep America America and insist on destroying America's core values and culture.


Here, let me reword it so hopefully you get it.
"It's about CONTRIBUTING their fair share into NATO, which Germany has not been doing.
Does that help or are you still confused and want to split hairs just to argue ?

The American military intelligence is an oxymoron. The trillions we spent and the hundreds of thousands we killed in Iraq looking for the WMD are the best proof. Not counting the other, less spectacular CIA blunders. Like the Tonkin scam.

I was not surprised to see Trump hesitate when asked who is the liar, Putin or the CIA.

You are like a dog with a bone....Germany belongs to the big four spenders for Nato...nearly the same as France and only abit less than the Brits (after them cooking their books)...that is alot of money every year...not to mention the troops and armory parked in Germany...the institutions like Ramstein...the intelligence cooperation...the following of german soldiers into far away adventures like Afghanistan...

Let it be!

I don't think the Commander and Chief is going to just "let it go."
After last week's NATO summit, by punishing a deadbeat ally that does not meet its NATO commitments and rewarding a steadfast ally that does.

Why should Germany a country that spends just 1.24 percent of its gross domestic product on defense continue to be rewarded with the economic benefit of U.S. bases?

"He" can do and say what he wants...I can report that his words have less importance in Europe by the day.


Good question. But one you won't find an answer for here in this board, I fear...