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2016 Presidential Elections in the US



AdrianK9
17 Mar 2016  #841

Again, no debating that Clinton is by far the most scandal ridden candidate because even the Dems know that's a fact... so let's take a look back at immigration:

Clinton said she was "adamantly against ILLEGAL" immigrants, not immigrants in general

Yes you're right. She said she was against illegal immigrants, supported the secure fence act, and did not want to give illegal immigrants licenses. However, she constantly flip flops on this situation. In this campaign, she has constantly stated how she wishes to help these illegal immigrants become citizens.

Her website says - 'She believes we should let families-regardless of immigration status-buy into the Affordable Care Act exchanges.' I thought she was ADAMANTLY AGAINST illegal immigrants.???? So she's against giving illegal immigrants a driver's license because that's a privilege for citizens, but yet wants to allow people REGARDLESS OF IMMIGRATION STATUS to be able to buy into Obamacare?? It also says on her website: 'She cosponsored the DREAM Act in the Senate in 2003, 2005, and 2007 to give undocumented students who grew up in the U.S. a chance to contribute to our nation's growth.' So she doesn't want to give an illegal immigrant (she called them undocumented by the way but that's just scemantics) a driver's license but will allow them to go to school here? Again, didn't she say she was against illegal immigrants - an illegal immigrant and an undocumented immigrant are the same thing... If a driver license is a privilege for citizens who didn't break the law by getting here, I don't see how Obamacare and an education is any different. If that's not a flip flop I don't know what is...

It also says at the bottom - 'Promote naturalization.... She will work to expand fee waivers' By saying she 'promotes naturalization' that's saying well so there's millions of illegal immigrants already here, so let's work to naturalize them, even if they got here illegally. On top of it, we'll make it cheaper for them and make current citizens foot the bill. Before this, when that waitress got killed in San Fran, she said she did not support sanctuary cities and their policies.

'Enact comprehensive immigration reform .... and enable millions of workers to come out of the shadows' So she first says she won't give licenses to illegal immigrants because they got here by breking the law but yet she wants that same group of people to now 'come out of the shadows'.

hillaryclinton.com/issues/immigration-reform/ is the link..

Since 1965, when the elites opened Americas doors to the Third World, immigrants from Asia and India people who are not white, not rich, and not connected have quietly succeeded.

I'm going to use a specific example with the Indians.. There are certain pockets in Chicago that have a very high percentage of Indian residents and they seem to follow a certain trajectory. The fresh immigrants live around the around of Devon and Western. It is a mixed area of Syrians, Lebanese, Palestinians, Orthodox Jews and Israelis, and a good amount of Indians. The Indians when they first move to the US they tend to live with half a dozen to a dozen people sharing a 2 bedroom apartment. They will work hard, save money, and will pool their resources to purchase a gas station, liquor store, franchise, or other small business. Then, they will get a little money and move out of the city to an area like Niles, Morton Grove, Schamburg, etc. - the middle class suburbs. As they save more money, they reinvest that capital, and in turn become more wealthy. Before long, 10-20 years have passed an now their meeting real estate agents viewing the $1 mil plus homes in Lake Forest and Hinsdale. These individuals aren't the ones committing violent crimes in record statistics, rioting because some skinhead mistook a Sikh for a Salafist, or running open air heroin markets in their own neighborhood like the blacks in Lawndale. These immigrants aren't

AdrianK9
17 Mar 2016  #842

Whats worse - a person who has accumulated enough money to own a train or the poor person who can't afford the ticket?

If a person accumulated enough money to own a train what should prevent him from purchasing that asset? If someone works hard and saves their money they are allowed to reinvest it - that's the beauty of a democracy. That train also employers conductors, engineers, maintenance workers, security, operators and provides arguably the cheapest transport available. One of the reasons why the Western states in the US became so wealthy is because of all the people vying to build railroads to establish transportation routes. Also, oftentimes ticket prices are set and very cheap. There's even discounts for students and children ride free on many lines. Even a minimum wage worker can avoid a bus or train ticket. If you can't afford a bus or train ticket, get a minimum wage job. One of the main reasons why people use this form of transport is because it tends to be far cheaper and oftentimes quicker in many large cities than driving a car.

Over here poor people behave inappropriately in line with their financial situation not their skin colour.

Why do so many Arabs of all different social classes demonstrate in the streets of London shouting Allah Akbar and create groups such as Sharia 4 UK to oppose established laws and customs?

Lyzko
17 Mar 2016  #843

In the US vs. the UK, it's MONEY which determines a person' supposed "rights" and privileges, and not class, pedigree or upbringing for the most part!!

The members of the Mayflower Society have been a dying breed for years, replaced by the nouveau riche trash who made it big either in the markets or before the Internet bubble burst:-)

I prefer the former to the latter; at least they grew into their wealth more comfortably.

AdrianK9
17 Mar 2016  #844

I would argue that actually connections are more important even than money and determine how successful you become. Yes, money is important but I think having connections even trumps that. Pedigree is important in the sense that cronyism and nepotism is rampant - even in colleges. If your parents or grandparents went to the same college that you sent an application to, it makes it much easier to get in. Upbringing is important too because your parents are your first role models and your first teachers.

The members of the Mayflower Society have been a dying breed for years, replaced by the nouveau riche trash who made it big either in the markets or before the Internet bubble burst:-)

The US and the west in general have a lot of social mobility. In the same way that a poor person can come up with a great idea and become a millionaire, so too can a rich person like Will Smith and MC Hammer become bankrupt by being irresponsible with their wealth. I do respect the old money certainly but if only old money ruled a society's financial systems then you'd have a total oligarchy. Look at some poorer countries like Moldova or Azerbaijan - it's the old money that pretty much rules everything from politics to banks. It's very hard for an average person to move up in the society. Also, some of the old money especially those who inherited a fortune just because of their least name have a ridiculous sense of entitlement and are far removed from reality whereas someone who was poor and gained wealth is oftentimes more in touch with society as a whole. I live in a rather WASP-y suburb where the East side is predominantly old money (Walgreens, Macys, and Schweppes families) while the West side (IBM co-founder, Mr. T, Vince Vaughn) where I live is more the new rich. The true wealth of the East though is far greater than the West and the houses are much more expensive. The one thing that upsets me about the new rich though is they often flaunt wealth that they don't really have. A lot of the old money doesn't do this and are often much more well mannered, cultured, and respectful... but bubbled. They'll have a nice house of course but they don't buy frivolous things or just throw money around. I've worked with my father on many wealthy people's homes and it seems almost like the richer the individual the more stingy they are. Many of the east side of money people drive very average cars like Ford Explorers, Volvos, etc. as their daily driver, but perhaps have a Ferrari as their sunday car, while the West drives Bentleys and Maseratis they're driving everyday that they're paying $1,000+ a month to lease or as payments. I personally drive a car worth around $3k because I want to lose as little money as possible through depreciation.

johnny reb
17 Mar 2016  #845

My answer is: we don't have that problem in the UK.

Well we do in the United States so maybe that is why you are so naïve.
Racism is alive and well in the US and the black people feel it, big time.

You have your shoe on the wrong foot Yose. It is the White people that feel the Racism.
No, it is the Blacks that perpetuate segregation because THAT IS THE WAY THEY WANT IT !
Get that through your head son, the Blacks don't want to improve themselves or segregate.
I think as usual you're massively over dramatising the situation

Buy yourself a plane ticket and fly into Chicago, rent a car and drive through south Chicago after dark mate and you will find out where the bear squats in the buckwheat. "IF" you make it back alive I will buy you dinner.
Imagine how a black person would feel living in a white world and reading this forum with all the racist Poles on here for example.

Then if they feel so bad WHY don't they take care of their own and DO SOMETHING about it and start cleaning up their own neighborhoods ????
America has bent over backwards giving them "appropriate environmental conditioning" which makes no difference.
The experiment has failed.
The fundamental problem is that American black culture has evolved into an unfixable and crime ridden mess.
They do not want to change their culture or society, and expect others to tolerate their violence and amoral behavior.
They have become socially incompatible with other races by their own design, not because of the racism of others but by their own hatred of non-blacks.
Your fantasy of "one world, one people" experiment doesn't seem to understand just how tired their white subjects are with this experiment.
They don't understand that white people aren't out to get black people; they are just exhausted with them.
They are exhausted by the social pathologies, the violence, the endless complaints, and the blind racial solidarity, the bottomless pit of grievances, the excuses, and the reflexive animosity.
So when you try to insult me with "Grand Dad mentality ignorance" can you see what a ignorant statement that is. lol
You answered your own naïve quandary with your answer to me.
My answer is: we don't have that problem in the UK.

Well we do here in the U.S.A. mate as you have yours with the Muslims in the U.K.
Do you really wonder "why" Trump wants to keep them out of the United States or do you just want another excuse to use one of your crutch words "racism".

AdrianK9
17 Mar 2016  #846

A lot of blacks actually complain about the whole segregation thing. You can't win the argument - they complain about being segregated from white society but yet they themselves chose to be with their own kind and primarily associate with other blacks. Of course there's exceptions but here's a few examples. . In my college there was like a black only floor of the dorm and a black only fraternity. Just about every black person wanted to live on that floor. In the cafeteria, the blacks tended to all sit together. Only 1 black guy though actually mentioned that this policy was counterproductive because it created a situation where the blacks were like segregated. However, this was created because the blacks themselves wanted it. Very few blacks sat with the white, Hispanic, and Asian kids. I don't know why it's specifically them too like the Asians didn't hang out only with Asians, the Mexicans with only Mexicans - they intermingled and sat with a mixed group of friends. Whereas the black tables in the cafeteria would be only black people.

The South side of Chicago isn't entirely ghettos in all honesty Johnny and if he did drive through it's unlikely he'd get shot if he stuck to the main roads. If he drove through a residential more than likely the only things that would happen is the guys on the corner would ask him 'watchu want' meaning what drugs do you want to buy, if you said none they'd ask you to leave their area or ask what you're doing there, and perhaps a female prostitute would spit on your car if she waves to you and smiles and you just ignored her.

All the nationalities in the US have tried to help the blacks. I just don't understand why this one group has such an issue with being productive and contributing members of society. The more you help them, the more they complain that they don't have enough. There's more programs for blacks than any other nationality even though they're 13% of the US population. They deride the same evil white devil that's supporting their lifestyle! Literally the taxes from the majority north side of Chicago prop up the majority poor welfare south side of Chicago. Our property taxes get raised a further 17% for properties over $250k and lowered for properties under $250k. This hurts the north side as there are very few homes worth under $250k whereas on the south side you can easily get a home for as cheap as $50k $60k and a remodeled one for even $120k-$150k. The businesses get hurt really bad too - the Ford factory for example will now have to pay an additional $2 mil a year in taxes. Just like the other large employers, they'll eventually move 30 miles east to Indiana or 30 miles north to Wisconsin since they'll save millions a year.

dolnoslask
17 Mar 2016  #847

Adrian, many will tell you that it is because the black people have been disenfranchised by white government , maybe they should be positively promoted to take more control of the country, at the end of the day they may achieve the mighty success that is Zimbabwe.

Lyzko
17 Mar 2016  #848

Johnny merely reiterates the age-old mantras of racists and white supremacists from Rankin and Bilbo right up though David the Duke himself ad nauseum!
He's blaming the victim once again and making the perpetrator(s) out as the victim, compassion fatigue,,HA!:-)

Remember folks, for every Eddie Luke (a white boy shot by an errant black police officer), there are uncounted Travon Martins out there!!

AdrianK9
17 Mar 2016  #849

country, at the end of the day they may achieve the mighty success that is Zimbabwe.

I'll tell you all about Zimbabwe as I'm actually very knowledgeable on this topic. Zimbabwe is currently a poor country that is a food importer and under Mugabe for the first time in decades had to rely on food aid from the UK and US. This was not the situation when Zimbabwe was Rhodesia ruled by a white government. When Zimbabwe was Rhodesia, unemployment was low, poverty was low (again compared to the current situation), and the average black lived better than they do now. The reason for this is because Rhodesia was a food exporter and it was the bread basket of Africa. Large industrial scale plantations owned by whites were worked on blacks and provided the country with income, food, and livelihood for all. When Robert Mugabe came to power, he confiscated the farms from the whites and oftentimes the owners were brutally murdered if they defended their land from confiscation. He thought this would be a good way to return the land back to the blacks and would empower the blacks. However, that's not what happened because the implementation was poor. Instead of dividing out the land amongst the common people, he gave the largest and best properties to his best friends, military generals, family members, and of course himself. The blacks did not know how to run these plantations with modern large scale techniques and hence food production plummeted and since economy was so reliant on agriculture so did the well being over average citizens. For the first time in decades, the country had to import food and was reliant on food donations from the US and UK. Mugabe realized the error of his ways and instigated a program to allow the whites back to their farmers - but as managers not as owners. So the whites were invited back to the farms to manage the workers but they would not be allowed to own the farm - so in many cases whites were asked to come back to the same farm that was stolen from them years back. Gradually, the economy is improving - but that's because many of the whites have returned back to these plantations...

So no, Zimbabwe is not a success story - Rhodesia was however.

dolnoslask
17 Mar 2016  #850

When I lived and worked in America I was surprised at the level of racial intolerance to black people , I Just do not understand it, Europeans do not have this issue to the same extent.

I Don't get it Black Americans fought for America during WWI,WWII and Vietnam, many died for their country.

What is really sickening, when Black us troops were stationed in the UK they were not allowed into pubs when US white soldiers were drinking , they had to alternate days separate black and white.

These very Black soldiers that thought for the freedom of Europe had to go home and sit at the back of the bus, they had no freedom after their service to freedom

AdrianK9
17 Mar 2016  #851

Blacks have been through a lot - every race and nationality has. We as Poles know that first hand. However, we don't commit crimes en masse and prey on government benefits. I have heard of that being an issue in the UK but it most certainly isn't in the US. Poles use to have the dump polak stigma till gradually the societies in which we lived realized we are hard working, God fearing, citizens who contribute to the society. We don't blame WW2 or the German devils for our problems and instead picked up a shovel and rebuilt the country instead of relying on others to support us for generation after generation.

edit:

Actually the Nazis treated their black troops better than the Americans during WW2 - little known fact.

dolnoslask
17 Mar 2016  #852

adrian I was being ironic about zimbabwe I was tagging on the back of your comment "There's more programs for blacks than any other nationality " My point was that these initiatives Don't succeed. Zimbabwe is a nightmare and living proof.

Yosemite
17 Mar 2016  #853

If a person accumulated enough money to own a train what should prevent him from purchasing that asset?

Under the globally dominant current system nothing, but i don't agree with that. The person who buys the train creates a company and buys more trains, then he creates an airline and corners the market for US to UK routes, muscling out all the smaller companies. These companies merge and merge until in the end one guy owns everything....and hes still not happy.

80 of the richest people on this planet have accumulated an equal amount of money to the poorest 3.5 billion.

Large corporations are essentially bad for the little guys and the longer capitalism is in place the worse it will get. Companies like Apple, Nike and Nestle have blood on their hands, somebody somewhere is slaving away for less than $2 / day so we can enjoy these products.

All political parties talk about is growth, growth, growth, how can we have infinite growth on a finite planet? Ohh its the immigrants fault, ahh wrong again. No wait its the benefit scroungers....nope. What it actually is - is capitalism, its flawed.

When I lived and worked in America I was surprised at the level of racial intolerance to black people , I Just do not understand it, Europeans do not have this issue to the same extent.

Yup

Wulkan
17 Mar 2016  #854

I don't consider the Czech Republic a Slavic country

But they are very slavic country, no matter how much you don't like it.

they are a mixture of East and West Europeans

and so are the Poles as it's proved by genetic studies

As soon as you cross the Southern border into Poland from The Czech side you notice the difference big time........which is why i left it out.

I still have a picture when I was crossing that boarder when I was 17 years old and no, there was no difference whatsoever. They are Central Europeans just like Poles. And the reason why you left out is because you couldn't fit in without knowledge of Polish language, racist attitude was not helping you either.

I dont know much about Slovenia so i cant really comment on that

Well if you went there you'd most likely say that you don't consider them a slavic country because they are doing too good for your ego :-)))

I dont know much about Slovenia so i cant really comment on that, but its certainly not classic (Slavic) Eastern Europe, more Southern central.

There is no such a thing like classical (Slavic) Eastern Europe. There is an Eastern Europe that is mostly Slavic indeed but even those countries differ from one another.

You think the Czechs live better than the Spaniards? you're off your rocker mate.

Ever been to the poorest areas of Spain? I bet you haven't and I bet you won't find areas like that in Czech republic.

and to top that off you're a bloody immigrant anyway

Yes I am just like you was for 6 years before you gave up and like your wife is in the UK right now.

a first generation immigrant complaining about coloured immigrants who have been in the UK much longer than you.

Care to say when did I make such a statement? or over active imagination is the steroids side effect?

Yosemite
17 Mar 2016  #855

Well if you went there you'd most likely say that you don't consider them a slavic country because they are doing too good for your ego

What are you prattling on about now?

AdrianK9
17 Mar 2016  #856

The Gypsies in Poland have been around a long time. They're treated as 2nd class citizens in Europe for a lot of good reason. There is a significant population in Poland - perhaps one of the largest minority groups. These individuals act the same whether they're in a poorer country like Poland and Romania as they act in Germany and Spain. I don't dislike gypsies as a race or nationality - I dislike the thieving aggressive beggars in Poland - most of whom are Gypsies. There is far more gypsies panhandling than alcoholics and addicts. Like for every 1 Polish homeless drunk beggar there are 10 gypsy beggars. They're totally shameless too, when you tell the Polish drunk no he'll usually leave you a lone. The gypsies will do whatever they can to force you to part with your money - begging, stealing, conning, scamming, whatever it may be.

These individuals seem to have some sort of predisposition towards not working a regular 9-5 to make a decent stable life. Instead, they chose to steal, beg, con, scam, or at best barter and trade. There has not been one day when I was in Wroclaw where I did not see groups of Gypsies/Romani. The women are notorious for being shop lifters, the men are often pick pockets and also seem The children I feel sorry for because they are essentially forced by their parents to pan handle all day long. One of the tricks the Gypsies love to do in Wroclaw is walk up to you while your using the ATM and ask directions or to translate something, will shove a piece of paper right up to your face like a flier or map for you to read, and then attempt to steal your money while your eyes are distracted. The children will perster you while you're sitting outside till you give them change. Everytime I sat outside at a restaurant or on a park bench they would flock to me like pigeons to a bread throwing grandpa. I guess they maybe could smell I'm not a local. Anyway, I already knew their dirty tricks so the only thing I'd offer them is advice - usually telling the children to go to school and get a job when their older, reporting their parents to police for forcing them to be street beggars, etc. would be enough for them to leave me alone. The women would soon after sweep in from out of nowhere and grab the kid by the hand and drag him or her away. The men will work in small groups to create situations to pickpocket you like bumping you on the subway or drop their change at the bottom of the stairs so that people have to go around. I've even heard of stories where the men would attempt to use scissors and cut off the handles on a purse and women that will go into a store and 1 will talk to the store owner while the other steals. They are a parasite to society and few have regular 9-5 jobs. Yes, increasingly they live in homes instead of wagons and trailers and work jobs but just about all the ones I saw while in Poland were the society preying scum type. There are some men who have stalls in the targ that handle used toasters, knock off ECKO and Nike tracksuits, and other knick knacks. However, the vast majority choses to beg, lie, cheat, steal, con, and commit other crimes - note the word CHOSES because they are chosing to participate in this behavior. Perhaps the kids would be the only exception because they're forced by their parents to panhandle.

Yet they have the audacity to question why Polish people don't like them...

AdrianK9
17 Mar 2016  #857

Czech republic.

My favorite country in Europe by FAR and my favorite city that I've ever travelled to is Prague as well. I don't know why I absolutely love Czech society, Czech people, Czech way of living.. they seem like Poles to me but more liberal (in the good kind of way not like the liberals here) in a unique Eastern European way like for example not being obsessed with religion like Poland, the high wages (but E. Europe standards) and low cost of living, the cars -Skoda!!, just everything I absolutely loved it. My favorite hotel that I stayed at was like a 'Sports' hotel they made for athletes it's called like Club Praha, Club Sport, Hotel Praha, something like that I don't remember the exact name.

Very good, but what has this got to do with Donald Trump?

Yosemite
17 Mar 2016  #858

The Czech ski resort of Spidleruv Mlyn was only a two hour drive from my house in Poland and i preferred it to Zakopane for the snowboarding. A really excellent resort, especially considering the mountains aren't much higher than 1600 meters.

You see the Roma Gypsies a lot in Wroclaw yes, but i didn't encounter them anywhere near as much as you. They certainly didn't harass me like you claim they did you. When we'd be drinking in the Rynek basically a dark skinned scruffy looking kid would just stand there with his/her hands out muttering something and that was about as bad as it got. I did see them operating in packs a lot too, but again they never really bothered me.

dolnoslask
17 Mar 2016  #859

So are gypsies in Poland considered / steryotyped to be the same as blacks in Donald Trumps America? Just asking

dolnoslask
17 Mar 2016  #860

"operating in packs a lot too, but again they never really bothered me", That might be because you are built like a brick SH$t house

But to be honest Gypsies have never bothered me either (Older Ex brick SH$t house)

Yosemite
17 Mar 2016  #861

^LOL^

Anonymous: Hacker Collective Announces 'Total War' on GOP Presidential Candidate Donald Trump
In an official announcement, the group vowed to "expose what he doesn't want the public to know," adding that Trump "[doesn't] stand for anything but your personal greed and power."

This is going viral on Facebook at the moment.

dolnoslask
17 Mar 2016  #862

"expose what he doesn't want the public to know,

Its one of two things,

1. He wears women's clothes in private (Models himself on Margaret Thatcher)

2. Cruelty to the hamsters he wears on his head.

johnny reb
18 Mar 2016  #863

Anonymous: Hacker Collective Announces 'Total War' on GOP Presidential Candidate Donald Trump

I heard that.
They were worried that it would cause Trumps protesters to come out with a massive protest.
Impossible though as all of Trumps protesters are working.

delphiandomine
18 Mar 2016  #864

Just thinking about this whole nomination business : are the Republicans really so retarded as to tear their party apart just to deny Trump the nomination if he's the clear leader going into the Republican National Convention?

It's pretty obvious that the anti-establishment vote behind Trump is going to go absolutely insane if they're denied - and Trump has the kind of ego that would force him to run for President just to see if he could pull it off.

Trump vs Sanders vs Kasich (or any other Republican) would be a ridiculously fascinating battle.

johnny reb
18 Mar 2016  #865

Russian state television appears to have thrown its support behind Donald Trump, hailing him as an anti-establishment candidate willing to cooperate with Moscow.
Wait til Crow hears this !

Bieganski
18 Mar 2016  #866

Hmm but what about the people who own the trains? Whats worse - a person who has accumulated enough money to own a train or the poor person who can't afford the ticket?

That's a very good scenario. A person who has accumulated enough money to own a train could never operate or maintain it alone even if it were kept as a museum piece. As a result jobs would be created. Now the poor person who couldn't afford a ticket could be given a job (if qualified), earn a salary to buy a ticket, and better yet may even enjoy free or discounted rides as a perk of employment.

As far as the American presidential election has been going I have only heard Trump express his intention to bring jobs back from overseas along with the trillions of dollars parked in offshore accounts due to what businesses in America regard as punitive taxes. Indeed, no business person wants to see the fruits of their enterprise and labor taxed by Big Daddy Government so that the welfare queens and dole trolls can divide their time between sleeping at home or play video games all day and then going out to bars, pubs and clubs all night. Yeah, a nice enjoyable lifestyle for some but...
Completely unsustainable.


Yosemite
18 Mar 2016  #867

Now the poor person who couldn't afford a ticket could be given a job (if qualified), earn a salary to buy a ticket

So he has to be a slave to the train owner. I don't think thats a good deal at all. Why should the train owner get to do nothing purely because he was lucky enough to accumulate the money to buy a train and have all these slaves making him even richer?

Lyzko
18 Mar 2016  #868

Simple grade school economics dictates (and has forever done so) that there will ALWAYS be certain people on the "top" vs. the "bottom" of EVERY society!! This isn't a yippy-dippy, 60's kumbaya exercise in intellectual masteration regarding whether such is fair vs. unfair, as the latter is compeltely incompatible with cold, mathematical logic, I'll give ya that one, okay?

The beef I and a lot of other Sanders as well as Clinton (former Obama aka New Deal Roosevelt) supporters have is the fact that compared to sixty to seventy years ago, management today is so off kilter with its subordinates, it's not even nearly on the par it once way, more five-hundred or more vs. sixty-one hundred times difference.

This means that the parity of workers with management is practically as unequal as it was in Charles Dickens' times, when the working man had ZERO say in anything (what with paulty few execeptions).

Again, is it too unrealistically idealistic to expect that even if some hard-working, non-union employees out there in the US can't ever afford to live in a mansion, drive a Mercedes, a Rolls and summer in Cannes each year, he or she has GOT to live in a broken-down
hovel, fighting no-rules barred rent increases and disappearing medical care, while the ever-increasing mega rich receive same without even blinking???!

Finally, to quote an editorial I read the other day, just because Trump speaks his mind, doesn't mean that it's not simply an expression of incurable foot-in-mouth disease! Plenty of demagogues in history have spoken their minds as well, plunging both their countries and the world into unimaginable chaos:-)

Yosemite
18 Mar 2016  #869

okay?

No its not ok. Equality in a financial sense needs to be achieved. It hasn't always been like that at all, before the days of money it was hierarchy based on physical power, alpha males and all that. We are supposed to be a civilised species yet were using system that is anything but civilised. Is it right that 80 people have accumulated the same amount of wealth as the poorest 3.5 billion? Is it right that millions of people die each year from preventable diseases? is it right that something like 40% of wildlife has been wiped out of existence within the past 50 years alone due to capitalism economic growth.

What you're talking about all sounds rosey mate, but its pretty fcuking far from the reality, reality covered up to perpetuate and keep the power exactly where it is.

Again, is it too unrealistically idealistic to expect that even if some hard-working, non-union employees out there in the US can't ever afford to live in a mansion, .............hovel, fighting no-rules barred rent increases and disappearing medical care, while the ever-increasing mega rich receive same without even blinking???!

Would you mind simplifying that sentence? although it reads impressively its virtually incomprehensible.

AdrianK9
18 Mar 2016  #870

So he has to be a slave to the train owner

Yosemite, unless you're a multimillionaire or a billionaire, chances are you are a slave as well. Do you have a mortgage or credit cards? You're a slave to the company and their interest rates. Even those who are self employed and make a good income off a small business are still financial slaves unless they have enough saved up to where they don't have to work anymore. There's not many of those. Even though I've lived my life so I don't have credit cards, a mortgage or car payments - and hence hardly any credit - but I don't really care because I pay for things with cash and don't live outside my means, I'm still a slave because I can't stop working without starving and losing my home.

You assume that the train owner was LUCKY enough to ACCUMULATE money - money doesn't grow on trees and aside from welfare queens no one is just going to hand it to you without you providing some good or service in return. Most likely the way this hypothetical train owner accumulated this wealth was by WORKING and SAVING - he perhaps was once a slave as well to some boss in his previous position but wanted to get out of the situation so he saves up money to become his own boss. Yes, there are those who are wealthy who furthered their wealth because they had the right connections which they didn't gain on their own. Most billionaire are self made - only a fraction made their money through inheritance. In fact, many billionaires started off as poor to middle class but came up with a great idea, formed a company, and made their wealth through having a significant share of stocks in their company making them extremely rich.

This brings us back to the examples of Indians, Asians and other immigrants that come to the US and become very successful. Are those people lucky too? I don't see how an Indian from a poor village making came to the US and before long he worked and saved up enough to buy a small business, reinvested that money, built more small businesses, and before long they are rich. There are countless 'Patels' in the US that are doctors, hotel owners, businessmen, etc. Patel actually means 'person of the land, farmer, etc.' - not the 'luckiest' social rung to be born into in India. So this poor Indian guy that came to the US and now is successful, are his Hotel cleaning ladies also his slaves? Is the immigrant Chinese doctor's receptionist also a slave?

Sanders as well as Clinton (former Obama aka New Deal Roosevelt)

Clinton will DESTROY investments if her tax plan passes and I'm sure it will because then it's more money for the IRS, hence the Fed, then the government- she is raising the capital gains tax to unprecedented levels. This isn't going to hurt day traders and the wealthy share holders and directors of corporations, because she's keeping the rates for assets held under 1 year at the current rate in her tax plan, but is dramatically increasing it for those that hold investments between 1 and 6 years. This hurts the 401k holders, middle class workers with maybe $10k in stocks that hold them for more than year but less than six, and deter foreign investment.

See this was fine when the economy was strong... Liberalism worked then because people were working, social security was viable, manufacturing was strong, and there weren't masses of section 8 welfare recipients. A hard working male could graduate high school, get a job at some car factory, and support a family without the wife having to work. Those days are long gone. Now it's hard for a college graduate to get a job that pays allows him or her to be the sole breadwinner of the family.

I do agree that minimum wages should go up a little. I think it is totally unfair that low skilled Walmart and McDonalds workers have to live on $260-$280 a week after taxes. However, $15 an hour is ludicrous - I didn't even make that much when I was a department manager at Menard's (worst job I ever had - only worked there 2 months). I feel that somewhere around $10 minimum for non high school grad and $12 minimum for high school grad would be a good policy. This would make the masses of dropouts more likely to finish too and create a slightly more educated population.

The founding fathers of this country fought so hard to prevent a federal reserve system from being established - well Woodrow Wilson allowed it in 1912. This total violation of the constitution dictates the US economy and politics. To compound it, the dollar was taken off the gold standard. The value of the dollar has decreased by many estimates 95%-98% (proportionate to the Consumer Price Index) since 1913.

Trump most likely won't win because of the ever important minority vote. I hate to say it, but this election is pretty much Hillary's and that makes me very sad and very worried - more so with her tax plans as this affects me more personally than some of her other policies. I don't understand why her supporters refuse to acknowledge the fact that is by far the most corrupt, lying, flip flopping candidate of the bunch.

I think Trump had a meeting with AIPAC recently - arguably the most powerful lobby in the US. He told some the attendees at an event hosted by some some Jewish Republican group that 'You know I'd be strong against Iran but you won't vote for me because I don't want your money.' I wonder how the AIPAC meeting went. This is why I like Trump - he is the least likely to be influenced by outside groups, lobbyists, etc.


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Off-Topic / 2016 Presidential Elections in the UStop