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Poland`s aid to Ukraine if Russia invades



Paulina
28 Feb 2022  #2,431

More than 400 Russian mercenaries (a private militia called "the Wagner Group") are operating in Kyiv with orders from the Kremlin to assassinate President Zelensky and his government and prepare the ground for Moscow to take control:

thetimes.co.uk/article/volodymyr-zelensky-russian-mercenaries-ordered-to-kill-ukraine-president-cvcksh79d

as long as you wither away and die as a nation

I think you're going too far with this, so speak for yourself.

This artwork titled "Seeds for Tomorrow" was done by an extremely popular digital artist, yuumei (a Chinese woman living in the US) - her comment on this piece:

twitter.com/Yuumei_Art

'Inspired by the brave Ukrainian woman who told the invading Russian soldier "Put sunflower seeds in your pocket so that sunflowers will grow when you die here."'




Velund
28 Feb 2022  #2,432

The US and its allies produce everything and more.

Did you looked at supermarket shelves last years?

You are one, we are many.

Minimalistic estimate - Russia + China + India (+ Iran if you wish) = 0.144bn +1,402bn + 1,38bn (+0.084 bn) = 3.01bn population (7,753bn is all Earth population). Really - Russia will have access for more markets and resources.

Especially if "iron curtain" will be in place and patent rights and other "holy cows" became puffs of air.

What do you think will happen after such a victory?

Hard form of cold war for some time. Then normalisation of relations with Germany/France/Italy/Spain. Don't give a fcuk about Poland/baltics if still will exist as a formally independent countries.

gumishu
28 Feb 2022  #2,433

Did you looked at supermarket shelves last years?

as far as I know the US is self-sufficient in regards of oil and gas in current prices - the US can even export their natural gas surplus to Europe - so yeah if you ask me there is a limit to possible inflation

PolAmKrakow
28 Feb 2022  #2,434

@Paulina
Too far? I don't think you have been alive long enough to truly understand the history of Russia. While you may understand Poland's history of Russian and Soviet oppression, you can not understand what the North American perspective is.

Talk to a military person, or politician outside of Russia and I assure you that to a man or woman nearly every one of them hopes Russia as it exists, and as it has existed since 1917 would simply disappear. New leadership from young people who are not enchanted or hypnotized by the former USSR is needed, and frankly Putin needs to be executed publicly to drive the point home.

After Russia there is China, but China understands it can not stand alone, and they understand that while an autocratic nation, they need to "appear" as though they treat their citizens better. This is exactly why China neither supports or condemns Russia, they are playing the fence.

Great piece of art though, and great sentiment from the Ukraine woman who inspired it.

@Velund
I go to the US every 6 to 8 weeks for a few days to a week. Supermarket shelves are fine, no issues with any supplies. Plenty of meat and vegetables everywhere. Plenty of outdoor markets as well. Supply chain disruption due to COVID has impacted some hard goods of course, but not the items people really need. None of those issues came from anything Russia has done or will do. As I have asked countless times, what does Russia have that the world can not live without? There is nothing.

Bratwurst Boy
28 Feb 2022  #2,435

Hard form of cold war for some time. Then normalisation of relations with Germany/France/Italy/Spain.

That's the thing! What normalisation? How?

Putin lied Scholz directly into his face!!! He PROMISED him personally that there would be no war!!! Only a few days before...as he already planned everything....

How do you think is a normalization between them possible? You need a minimum of trust for that!

I imagine the Ukrainians still not giving up...a kind of guerrilla/resistance even after russian victory....remember Afghanistan? Or what Vietnam became for the US?

Do you think that the West just shrugs to that and re-opens all relationships again with Russia? Ends the sanctions? Treats Putin again like an equal? As one of us? Totally ignoring the Ukrainians? No longer supporting them with money and weapons and humanitarian aid? No longer shunning and isolating Russia? Really?

mafketis
28 Feb 2022  #2,436

Don't give a fcuk about Poland/baltics

Well that's a lovely sentiment. I actually don't wish Russia or Russians harm or ill will. I would just like them to stop invading their peaceful neighbors.

Why not try to create an attractive standard of living for people instead of following a vain dictator's dreams of imperial glory (that require the mass sacrifice of young Russian men and miserable living standards for the populace)?

Russia could be an intellectual and cultural and economic superpower but all the Russian state seems interested in doing is trying to dominate its neighboring countries (and protecting the ill gotten gains of oligarchs).

What a waste of potential....

PolAmKrakow
28 Feb 2022  #2,437

@mafketis
That was perfect maf. A waste of potential. 1917 to today.

Velund
28 Feb 2022  #2,438

Putin lied Scholz directly into his face!!! He PROMISED no war!!!

Situation changed in mere hours. 150000+ of ukraine troops will be prepared for overwhelming attack to LNR/DNR to "close this question at once" and even trucks with shells will be on artillery positions.

But... No luck for US masters this time. And Zelensky "nuclear fantasies" was a last straw... It's why russian troops take nuclear stations and nuclear waste storage objects under control ASAP.

Situation is irreversible, there is no way to make nice plutonium sphere from a large mushroom-like cloud.

mafketis
28 Feb 2022  #2,439

With allies like these:

Putin-bro and number one fan is on the case!

twitter.com/rianru/status/1498095033559437321

"Kadyrov, after the statements of Johnson, Truss, Borrell and von der Leyen about new sanctions, demanded that they withdraw their statements "before February 31", threatening retaliatory measures"

gumishu
28 Feb 2022  #2,440

No longer shunning and isolating Russia? Really?

this was probably Putin's plan: survive some minor sanctions untill Europe becomes 'reasonable' again and it's all business as usual - I hope Russians realize soon that the mood has changed

Paulina
28 Feb 2022  #2,441

I wonder how many Russians think (or feel) this way

Probably many... I've read that over half of Russians support the invasion...

New leadership from young people who are not enchanted or hypnotized by the former USSR is needed

Yes and this is what I'd like to see and not for Russian people to "wither away and die as a nation (which is rather impossible to happen to such a big nation anyway).

And another artwork - this time from Lithuania by Beata Kurkul:

instagram.com/beata_kurkul/




Velund
28 Feb 2022  #2,442

Why not try to create an attractive standard of living

Now try to keep your current standard of living without chances to plunder half of the world to stop next crisis. We will take care of this.

Bratwurst Boy
28 Feb 2022  #2,443

this was probably Putin's plan:

I guess that too....he surely counted on Germany still wanting to play the "bridge"....preventing the worst....and be the first to move on again afterwards as if nothing had happened...like after Georgia and Crimea...

Well...that was a miscalculation!

mafketis
28 Feb 2022  #2,444

not for Russian people to "wither away and die as a nation (which is rather impossible to happen to such a big nation anyway)

The Russian ethnicity is not in good shape. Fertility is way too low markers of social dysfunction are way too high and Putin doesn't even seem to like them young smart kids being arrested for nonsense* are all ethnic Russians... (he seems to prefer Caucasians and Central Asians and is busy conducitng his own 'great replacement').

*dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10501625/Russian-boy-16-jailed-five-years-planning-blow-virtual-building-Minecraft.html I'm told there are a lot more of these cases reported in Russian language media and it's always ethnic Russians being targeted

Bratwurst Boy
28 Feb 2022  #2,445

threatening retaliatory measures

That will make the mood on Germany only worse....for Putin!

The muslims also got always more unpopular after every terror attack in the name of Islam....that never works! Every "retaliory measure" will only close the ranks...Idiot!

mafketis
28 Feb 2022  #2,446

will make the mood on Germany only worse

They still have time... it's not February 31 yet!

gumishu
28 Feb 2022  #2,447

hehehe :)

PolAmKrakow
28 Feb 2022  #2,448

Maf, this is exactly what the world thinks of Russian leadership. February 31st. What a Fing moron.

@Velund
As for the standard of living in the US and other EU countries. The average McDonalds worker has a better standard of living than most Russian's. The average Pole much better. Your idea's of threats to a developed nation are laughed at. Like your country is laughed at. This is exactly why Russians are paranoid and suffer from inferiority complex. Again, what does Russia have that the rest of us cant live without? Answer the question for all of us, but answer it for yourself first. When you finally understand that you have nothing, then you will realize the point from which your nation bargains from.

Ukraine reminds me of the 1980 USA hockey team. Small, undermanned and united. Russians still feel that loss, and it is exactly that feeling that all the world, not just USA has toward Russia. When the USA beat Russia, the world celebrated, and when Ukraine does the same the world will celebrate again.

Bratwurst Boy
28 Feb 2022  #2,449

In other news:

Schalke 04 separates from the Russian state-owned company Gazprom

German head of association: Exclude Russian team from Paralympics

France's head of association pleads for Russia's World Cup exclusion

The Czech Republic also wants to boycott the World Cup playoffs against Russia

Putin suspended as honorary president of the World Judo Federation

Russians and Belarusians start at the Biathlon World Cup under a neutral flag

Uefa before separation from major sponsor Gazprom

focus.de/sport/fussball/nach-angriff-russischer-truppen-ukrainischer-fussball-verband-setzt-meisterschaft-aus_id_58605632.html

....and that's just the beginning...it's getting lonely around Putin....and frankly I don't see that getting better after a russian victory in Ukraine, only worse....no normalization imaginable!

pawian
28 Feb 2022  #2,450

West is much more vulnerable than Russia.

Don`t be silly. Your economy will be ruined and you will eat rat sandwiches until the day when ordinary Russians decide they have had enough of living in disgrace and debasement and they will storm the Kremlin and change the system.

Velund
28 Feb 2022  #2,451

will storm the Kremlin and change the system

You'll tell this sweet tale to your grandchildren when you treat them to a stew of mice.

Russia can play downshifting game much longer than so called "western democracies".

pawian
28 Feb 2022  #2,452

when you treat them to a stew of mice.

You got everything mixed up - I serve mice stew to my cats, not grandkids.

Russia can play downshifting game much longer

Yes, I can see the first signs of it - right now Russia is playing the game of endurance with its soldiers who are underfed and underequipped. Besides, they were told they were sent to Ukraine for regular training. Putin is only testing their endurance to extreme conditions. Such a game. Those few who survive Ukrainian resistance will be awarded the Lenin Medal for Brave Survival. hahaha

Bratwurst Boy
28 Feb 2022  #2,453

@Velund

Velund, Russia has always been so proud of it's people during the war and rightfully so...how they never gave up and resisted the german Nazi invader....never stopped fighting the at that time best military machine in the world...

Now Russia is the invader and the Ukrainians are the brave resister who won't give up their freedom and their homeland to a much stronger foreign military force...Russia has now become the bad guy, the invader, the occupier, the destroyer of a peaceful country, the murderer of women and children, forcing millions to flee...hated and despised by the world.

You can't be happy about that! Have you forgotten?

pawian
28 Feb 2022  #2,454

You can't be happy about that!

Of course he isn`t but he has to pretend the opposite - doing it for a living.

Bratwurst Boy
28 Feb 2022  #2,455

O wonder what would had happened if there had been already social media during the Third Reich....

GefreiterKania
28 Feb 2022  #2,456

FB and Twitter in 1939! Imagine all those pictures and videos of Westerplatte heroic defence sent around the world for six days! Then Wizna, Bzura battle, the heroic cavalry skirmishes. The entire world would love us! France and UK would have to invade Germany from the west and end the war in a month. :)

And all the atrocities documented and broadcast LIVE! The entire world would have ganged up against Hitler much earlier!

Paulina
28 Feb 2022  #2,457

Those few who survive Ukrainian resistance will be awarded the Lenin Medal for Brave Survival. hahaha

lol pawian...
Let us send Velund in a tank to Ukraine... I'm sure such a great patriot will be happy to die there needlessly instead of some boy from an "exotic" republic who was sent there as cannon fodder...

Bratwurst Boy
28 Feb 2022  #2,458

FB and Twitter in 1939

Or earlier.....imagine pictures of the first Konzentrationslager.....and what was done to the Jews and opposition (long before the war)....would Hitler had made it to '39?

Would Chamberlain still accept the end of Czechoslovakia, still trying to appease Hitler?

GefreiterKania
28 Feb 2022  #2,459

Chinese traders have just stopped buying Russian coal for fear of western sanctions...

biznes.interia.pl/gieldy/aktualnosci/news-chinscy-traderzy-wstrzymuja-zakupy-rosyjskiego-wegla,nId,5860636

... so much for Russian-Chinese cooperation. :)

Bratwurst Boy
28 Feb 2022  #2,460

Apropos the "big saviour" China:

As Russia's isolation grows, China hints at limits of friendship

aljazeera.com/economy/2022/2/28/as-russias-isolation-grows-china-hints-at-limits-of-friendship

...Even as Beijing has refused to term Russian President Vladimir Putin's assault on Ukraine an "invasion" and condemned Western-led sanctions, Chinese state-owned financial institutions have been quietly distancing themselves from Russia's beleaguered economy.

The moves suggest a careful balancing act by Beijing as it seeks to buttress ties with Moscow without openly violating sanctions, which could jeopardise its access to key Western export markets and the US dollar-centric international financial system.


Well.....slimey Chinese....what did anybody expect? Them being loyal to anybody???


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