Poland`s aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 2

Just like other kids, whose names is in long list on stones of "Alley of Angels" in Donetsk? Just like 14000+ civilians, killed by ukrainian fire since 2014 in Donbass?

Enough is enough...

True.

None of this would have happened if Russia had not invaded Ukraine for no reason.
Surely, even you can see that now?

None of this would have happened if U, the EU, and the US observed and obeyed Minsk and U stayed neutral. Russia accepted NATO in the Baltics the way the US would never accept Warsaw Pact in Canada or Mexico.

No, Russia is not obligated to be mathematically consistent. Russia drew the red line at Ukraine and will do all it can to make sure it remains uncrossed. Don't like it? Sue 'em.

you care about that? Is serbia alongside russia as countries you like?


None of this would have happened had russia not invaded, first in 2014, then in 2022. In both cases russia invaded Ukraine did not.

You again trying to point to some [convenient for you but not related to reality] moment of "beginning of troubles".

Iraq did not invade the US so all is fine as far as Russia goes. Find something more compelling than that.


That's what desperate purists do. Soon, we will be discussing snakes and apples.

@Novichok, Velund, not really. It was Russia that decided to resolve it's issues with Ukraine by force - by invading it. Putin made a concious decision knowing that it may mean people getting killed, without warning Ukraine that it's choices will lead to war.

So, if it wasn't for Putin's decisions those kids in Donetsk would still be alive. Ukrainians wouldn't kill them. Noone would kill them. Kids in Mariupol, Irpin, Bucha, etc. - they all would be alive, if it wasn't for Putin.

Yes, just as the US and Poland decided to resolve their issues with Iraq by force. Both countries made a conscious decision knowing that it may mean people getting killed.

I admire your selective sensitivity.

So if one opposed the Iraq invasion then one can also oppose russia's invasion of Ukraine?

Cause I opposed it and if you supported the Iraq invasion then you're too stupid to have an opinion about anything.....

That invasion didn't come as a surprise though, as far as I remember, while 2014 was a shock.

From Wikipedia: "In October 2002, Congress granted President Bush the power to decide whether to launch any military attack in Iraq. The Iraq War began on 20 March 2003"


Sorry, but you can't accuse me of "selective sensitivity" in this case, because I was against the invasion of Iraq. I already wrote about this on PF.

War crimes of Ukrainians in 2014. No one has registered them, however, they don't expire:

Those are russian war crimes, not Ukrainian....

You trying to say that your "selective sensitivity" is applied on case by case basis?

For example, independency of Polish people on historical Polish lands cannot be discussed, but independency of Russians of Donbass and Novorossia on historical Russian lands is impossible thing and former Austrian serfs from Galicia is in their own right to suppress it by steel and blood?

PS: Last evening three children were killed and three more wounded when Ukrainian Nazis shelled Makiivka.

The children were playing at the playground, which was hit by the Ukrainian armed forces. One boy died immediately, the other died on the way to the hospital. Doctors fought to the last moment for the life of an eight-year-old girl, but she died in intensive care.

Two adult civilians were also wounded.

youtu.be/iSHKSI5vVqw

Poroshenko Admits That Kiev Never Intended to Agree to a Peace Deal With the Donbass Region

with jews you lose

Hey, Duma, write that damn piece of paper and make things right. Paulina is getting po-ed.

Hey, Paulina, are we OK now?
I thought so. Cool...

100 year old US Marine Corps veteran breaks down crying

"This is not the country we fought for"

t.me/intelslava/32458

@Velund, Poles were fighting for independence because they didn't have an independent country. If people in the Donetsk and Luhansk regions considered themselves to be Russians then they didn't have to fight for an independent country, because they already had an independent country - Russia. If they didn't want to live in Ukraine, they could move to their fatherland - Russia. Poles didn't have such a choice, that's why they had no other way but to fight for having a country of their own.


Sorry, but Russians are such hypocrites. You denied Chechens the right to have their own independent country, but you demand independence for a bunch of Russians on a piece of land belonging to Ukraine, even though they have a big country of their own already - Russia! You killed Chechens, YOU RAZED GROZNY TO THE GROUND just to keep their ethnic lands in Russia! So your Donbas Russians can have their own country, but Chechens can't? lol How does THAT work in your head?

If Russia was in the same situation as Ukraine is, you know very well that Russia wouldn't give up it's territory either. People would be getting killed, just like in Chechnya back then and just like in Ukraine now. Putin started all of this by invading Ukrainian territory, not Ukraine. So why are you crying me a river now?


When we were writing about civillians getting killed in Mariupol and other places due to Russian shelling Novichok would write: "Hey children, that's war. Z can stop this any time" and you would claim that Azov was hiding behind every building that was hit. I could write the same thing: "Hey, zhopniks, that's war. Putin started it and Putin can end this any time. And there were Russian soldiers and Wagner men hiding behind that building."


I guess you could say that - not every case is the same... You can't put a fixed template to every situation. The world and life is more complicated than that.

@Novichok, no, we're not OK. There's a difference between almost half a year and one day.

Very true. And after levelling the Grozny they installed a corrupt terror regime.


I fear we have to prepare for terrible news once the city has been liberated by the Ukrainians again. Satellite images showed possible mass graves for 20k citizens.

Freudian slip, Mr. T?
However one feels about Russia and Putin, do not bet that they will give anything back just to watch what they lost go to waste.

Lenin does not asked anyone before seccession of part of Russia to give it away to newly (artificially) created ukrainian state. So, people of Donbass and Novorossia do not need someone's else permission to reverse that territorial transfer most democratic way possible - by referendum. It taken place 11.05.2014 in DNR and 27.04.2014 in LNR. In both cases vast majority voted for independency. In other regions of Novorossia attempts of self-determination was suppressed by open terror.

Paulina, if you so swift to decide who should move where in case of problems - start from Danzig and Pomorze, issue them your advice to move to Poland proper...

Life is not this-therefore-that. Life is about the size of your fist so stop that Civics 101, third-grade girlie nonsense.

Quoting:

Zelensky's court bans another Ukrainian opposition party
A court has banned two more parties, including the communists, bringing the total number of outlawed political groups to 15

...but there are still plenty of morons ready to die for Ukrainian "democracy" and "freedom". Or is it "freedoms"...whatever that means.

Now readers' comments:

There you have it, democracy is outlawed in Ukraine and the West continues to support Ukrainian Nazis because they hate Russians. STUPID and uninformed morons.

Amazing how the west lies constantly "we have to fight Russia to save democracy" there's no democracy in Ukraine at all

Finis sanctificat media.... ;) ;)

I have to admit, outlawing political parties is a stupid practice, and really not possible. Any group can organize and become a party under another name. Only two groups should be banned, Nazi's and Communists.

Funny how there is an outcry over 2014 when Russia is the one who invaded. The level of moronic thinking once again is surprising. As for a Minsk agreement, there wouldnt have been a need for one had Russia not invaded in 2014. Again, lets go back to who is the invasion force on another country's lands.

You are quoting "readers comments" that were written by Vanya and Kostya who are sitting in the cube next to you wondering why they didn't get their June salary yet.

This is a Polish forum - i don't know why it is full of Russian shills but among normal Poles you are not going to find many who will shed tears about the Communist Party being outlawed

In separate news it is great to see the oil price down 10 percent yesterday - The Nazi bullies can drink their oil next year at this rate

Darling,. Ukraine is in a state of war with Mongol barbarians who are still strong and resort to dirty methods like murdering civilians. It is normal in such a situation that all potential 5th columns are seperated politically and even detained. And communists are such traitors posing danger to Ukraine`s independence coz they support Mongols.

All countries do it during the war.

When it finishes, there will be time to think about bringing them back.


Yes, Novi is like a 5th column traitor- if the USA was in the state of war, he should be detained and kept in isolation . hahahaha

Political parties funded by a foreign power whose goal is the destruction of the country..... it's okay to ban them.

We should be rather careful with such arguments, because they are very easily dismissed with "if Albanians in Kosovo didn't want to live in Serbia, they could have moved to their fatherland - Albania". But they didn't. Serbia was bombed and on Serbian lands ethnically Albanian state of Kosovo was created, with full support of the West.

We can be either imperialist i.e. we think that countries should be able to keep lands and regions of different ethnicities under their control. In such case we should support: Serbia controlling Kosovo, Russia controlling Chechenya and Ukraine controlling Crimea and Donbass.

Of course, we can also be against imperialism; in such case we should support the rights of ethnic Albanians in Kosovo, Chechenyans' right to their independent country and ethnic Russians' struggle in Crimea and Donbass.

However, something strange seems to happen here - people on both sides (the Western camp and the Russian camp) take staunch imperialist position when it suits them and then with happy smiles on their faces argue vehemently for an anti-imperialist position, when it suits them.

Of course, it isn't strange at all when we realise that we live in a world in which superpowers fight for influence and resources, and in this power struggle they will support any positions, no matter if mutually exclusive, to justify their actions. Welcome to the real world of adult people, children. That's why, instead of trying to claim moral high ground, we should admit that it's all about strategic interests of our respective countries/alliances. We, Poles, support Ukraine because we think that it suits our long-term strategic interests to keep Ukraine stronger and Russia weaker. As long as we have Putin and his mafia in power in Russia, and as long as people like Dugin are listened to by Russian ruling class instead of being locked up in a lunatic asylum, our position seems totally valid from Polish interests point of view. If, on the other hand, we had democratic Russia with, for example, Navalny as president and all the Dugins safely locked in психу́шки, would we be so eager to support Ukraine, with their UPA cult, official Bandera celebration year, and lovely Shukhevych poststamps?