Poland`s aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 2

When did Russia become a model of good manners? When it is impossible to hide Polish hypocrisy?

I don't think Zelensky ever claimed to be the moral beacon of the world. He is a freely elected leader trying to protect his citizens and keep his country free. I'm sure like most politicians he has lots of faults.

Putin is a bully even to his own friends - we all saw those pathetic videos of him and remembered our schooldays

Tolstoy would be appalled but not surprised that Russia remains stuck in the 19th century - and will be until someone decides to throw Putin in front of a train

Poland isn't the hypocrite type like USA. We have that "poet" syndrome though that you described very well.

Btw, Crow, are you implying that Crnogorac3's links aren't serious? :))


Hey, you and other Putin's shills pretend to care so much for Afghanistan, so I wonder what Russia did to help that country and it's people?

It's not hypocrisy. I used the wrong term. It's selective outrage about Russia among PF posters that really bugs me.


I don't give a rat's ass about Afghanistan. That sh*ithole is just a debating tool that I find useful when the High Moral Ground gets too many Russia-hating virtue-signaling Polish PF poets.

Not comparing to Tolstoy.

Yeah I know. It's not just here though, it's all over the US, Europe, etc. There's a half dozen other conflicts that are just as bad and they don't get a mere mention on the news. But because Russia is involved, well, that makes it a whole other story.

Ukraine is now all of a sudden the beacon of democracy and good governance? Please...

Well, they did elect a jewish comedian to run the country after all...

I don't think my outrage is that selective. I already wrote that I was against the invasion on Iraq. That invasion was not one mistake, but series of mistakes. I have a different view on Afghanistan though. Why? Because I'd rather die from an American bomb than live under the Taliban. On the other hand - I don't have the right to make such a choice for others.

I hope that the world (especially it's Western part) learned from those mistakes and realised that you can't change a society and people's mentality by invading a country and occupying it for some time.

My outrage concerning Russian invasion of Ukraine is greater though. Why? For a few reasons:

- unlike in case of Iraq and Afghanistan, Russia wants to overthrow a democratically elected government;

- unlike in case of Iraq and Afghanistan Russia is making a propaganda of hate and dehumanizing against the Ukrainians, which results in war crimes being perpetrated by Russian soldiers on Ukrainian civillians on a shocking scale;

- unlike in case of Iraq and Afghanistan (as far as I know), whole cities, towns and villages are being levelled to the ground;

- unlike in case of Iraq and Afghanistan, Putin is denying Ukraine the right to exist as a country and for Ukrainians the right to be a seperate nation;

- unlike in case of Iraq and Afghanistan, Russian soldiers won't leave;

- all the continuous, neverending lying and fake news on the Russian side. It's just unbearable;

- Ukraine is just over our border, we have common history, similar cultures and Russia could do this to us too, so it hits closer home (the only "hypocritical" reasons I can think of).

Another Kennedy died because of the deep state, this time voluntarily.


Again an "evacuation".

twitter.com/Levi_godman/status/1528790834321231873

twitter.com/Levi_godman/status/1528792170915844098

twitter.com/AZmilitary1/status/1528796542014050311

t.me/RVvoenkor/13340

Liman.

Another Serbian settlement in Ukraine which was named after an area of Crow's city of Novi Sad is about to be liberated.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liman,_Novi_Sad

...pretend, provoke, lie, and act surprised. Oh, my God, those Russians are so aggressive and paranoid.

Your post was way too long. Mine is going to be shorter:

NATO was supposed to be defensive. It was not. See Serbia, Iraq, and Afghanistan. NATO was supposed to protect Europe from the USSR. The USSR is gone but that cancer grew bigger. Putin drew a red line. Cancer ignored it as it did the Minsk Agreements. That's why Russia now has C, D, K, L, , M. and soon Z.

Any questions, children? You, in the back row...No, Russia is not going to leave any of those places. You can bet your sandwich.

Legitimate points. But, it's also not as if Russia has been completely worthy of trust. I say this as someone who believes America has lacked sufficient humility in forming the post-Cold War order-we've done a lot of good but made some bad moves too.

You think Putin will emerge after this Ukrainian situation as powerful domestically as he is now or do you think he'll increase or decrease in power?

I just read (from an ex MI-6 guy no less) Putin won't make it even to 2023....he is so sick he will just vanish in some sanatorium...so a powerful future is shrouded in doubts, no matter what happens in Ukraine!

newsweek.com/putin-will-gone-2023-likely-sanatorium-predicts-ex-mi6-chief-1708926

PS: Some hardliner Nikolai Patrushew is seemingly slated as his successor....also already 70!

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikolai_Patrushev

Deputies from Zelensky's party propose to allow commanders to KILL their soldiers in order to stop mass surrender and flight from positions

The bill has the number 7351 and was published on the official website of the Verkhovna Rada

beacon of democracy rule of law and western values.

Old news.
So you didn't believe a Yank but you do a MI-6 guy ?

...curious.....I only heard about that from russian commanders....

nypost.com/2022/05/16/russian-commanders-allegedly-kill-their-own-wounded-soldiers/


MI-6 !!! :)

@Bratwurst Boy

That's the question: who would succeed him? Doubtful it's going to be some kind of dovish guy who really truly wants to the West the ole reach around. That's why I don't like this scorched earth policy many are espousing. As the other PF German so astutely said, Russia isn't going anywhere, we need to live with it.

Well....I feel abit like back in my school days....in East-Berlin....as Brezhnev died....first followed another old party sack Andropov.....then he died too....then came another old sack Chernenko...then he died too....but then came...tadaaa...GORBATSCHOW! :)

So, there is always hope! :)

Me, too.


Just imagine Putin or his replacement saying: Never mind the lost men and tanks. That was a mistake and we are soooo very sorry.

I will give birth to twins first...

Nun ja, that was exactly what Gorbatschow said and did.... the end of the Sovietunion and the liberation of all occupied soviet territories....remember? So it is possible!

Putin tries to rectify this....but not very successfully....

Let's not fool ourselves and believe he wanted the system to go anywhere.

We have to accept Russia as Russia is, we can't try to imagine it as we wish. We have to find a way to co-exist peacefully and prosperously together...I have no idea how to do it, just saying.

Would you had said the same about Hitler's Germany?

We have rules in Europe, for lotsa good reasons....not at least historical!

All the little sniveling trolls now complaining how Russia is just doing what the US did in so many other places are laughable. All you dumb F's forget that Afghanistan was being run by the Taliban in 2001, and a little attack on the US brought on the war. You really are Fing morons and those of you in the US should be prosecuted as traitors for supporting Russia.

Poor Russian's have their little feelings hurt. No one cares. No one has cared. I have been saying this since the beginning, and now you little Russian scum are upset about it? Give me a break. We do not care about your little hurt feelings. We do not care about your country or your self inflicted pain over the centuries. So in this one regard, you are right, we do not care about Russia or Russian's. Yes, we think you are a backward retarded nation that does nothing for anyone. Any more brilliant statements on how unfair it is?

Russia invaded Ukraine. Unprovoked. Russia thinks it has a right to dictate what happens in Ukraine when Ukraine has its own rights and is not a part of Russia. Russian army is full of rapists and thieves. Russian leadership has been raping and thieving Russia for decades. Scum on the ground is no different from the scum at the top who simply wear better suits because their thieving is higher level.

Beebs, this isn't on that scale. I'm not glossing over the bad being done, but this is not the same thing.

If it were, we'd need to amass an army and take on Russia and overthrow the government.

Why are you living there??? You're like the Blacks who forever complain about racism but continue to live in the States. You should relocate back to Poland and welcome in your Russian masters.

Yeah, but that could be like saying instead of having a blood alcohol level of .3 it's now .25. Drunk either way you slice it.


I'd agree that's certainly part of it, but he has a certain timbre of pontification at times--not that it's not understandable. There's something there that gives me pause, though.

Who knows......I'm generally of that opinion that you don't overthrow another nuke-power with a foreign army....buuuuut....there are surely other ways....

Or we do it the old fashioned way and wait till the successors all died of old age till someone else...a younger one.....brings some change...or till the Russians themselves get sick of it, whatever comes first!

But I don't see just acceptance and common prosperity etc....such a government who doesn't accept the european borders will always be seen and treated as a threat!

We not only said it to Mao - the worst criminal ever - but we moved the wealth-creating manufacturing sector to his country hoping that the snake will morph into a prince. Putin is Mother Teresa in comparison.

Certainly, but that doesn't mean you don't forge some kind of strategic agreement. It's not that only best buddies enter into agreements of mutual benefit.

Anyhow, I posted enough today to last me until the end of Summer. Talk with you later.

True....but Mao and China are far far away....and the dead are Chinese....Kiev is not even 2 hours from Berlin away....the killed, the destroyed, the refugees are all European....that makes all the difference in the world!

Count the bases and aircraft carriers and it's clear that Russia's military is purely defensive. Do the same with NATO and...
As the events in Ukraine reveal so far, all that talk about Russia conquering Europe is beyond laughable. They have no means or reason. What they do internally is nobody's business.