Poland`s aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 4

Not really.... he used to be very good on the excesses and evils of end-stage neoliberalism and vulture capitalism but he's completely wrong on Ukraine.... (a common problem in the US, good on some domestic issues and terrible internationally or vice versa....)

Here is an excellent video on the written sources of putain's ideology/philosophy (much of which has been on display for years).

Dugin is barely mentioned as his importance in russia is... non-existent and everything he does is plagiarize the work of the others....

The real influences are

Ivan Ilyin - russian nationalism and mystical fascism

Lev Gumilev - russians as a chosen nation meant to lead the world (and a bunch of anti-semitic stuff too)

Carl Schmidt - nazi stuff, spheres of influence (and 'great powers') and the need for a leader of a 'great power' to be above the law....

youtube.com/watch?v=sdFtqa54TuM

Very educational though listening to it is like wading in the cleaning pond of a pig slaughterhouse.... yech very nasty stuff.... and it's all been out in the open for years and westerners didn't want to see it

Hey, all-knowing geniuses, am I getting the evidence that the Russian army changed the outcome of the Crimean referendum from NO to YES or not?

the whole thing was rotten through and through (and I also told you of evidence that was widely available of unreliable vote tallies) so it's a moot point so you're not getting an answer Darrell....

and if NATO wants Crimea to belong to Ukraine there's nothing much russia will be able to do...

@Novichok
Now you admit it was the Russian army? According to all Putinazi's it was in no way the Russian army. If it was, then the Russian army invaded Ukraine illegally in 2014 and anything after that is illegal. You know fruit of the poison tree, or ill-gotten gains.

@mafketis
Exactly. Russia is just a biatch to NATO and Russia knows it, that why they cry about it all the time. But wait, hadn't we moved on to the Satanic war?

or weaponized mosquitoes?


I dont' think Darrell cares about that....

(Darrell is my new nickname for him since his behavior here is so similar to the behavior of Darrell Brooks during his trial... lots of samples on youtube if you don't know what I mean....)

Sorry, Vatnik. Every time there are polls, they show the support for Ukraine in the West is not flagging.
If Russia wants to win, they will have to beat a western backed Ukrainian military on the battlefield. They will not be able to get the West to stop supporting Ukraine, or the Ukrainian people to give up, without first beating the Ukrainian military.

And I bet that Iranians can still build those shi*tty drones even though Ruskies are unable to keep building more missiles. We will witness the same downgrade we have seen with tanks - Ruskies will go from missiles to toy airplanes just like they went from T-72B3s to T-62s. And neither will help them.

Yes, and it only shows nothing is forever in this world.


Exactly. RuSSists have committed too many crimes in Ukraine - now the compensation has to be profound - RuSSists have to fully withdraw from occupied territories, pay reparations, send Putin and other criminals to international tribunals. And only then will the West lift the sanctions which are ruining RuSSia`s economy so nicely.

This is true, but Putin and the others will never face trial.
That is just pure fantasy!

Russia will lose this war and both Russia and Putin will pay a very high price for that.
But Putin will never face a court of law..
You are a dreamer.

youtu.be/W9EgwaPY67E

2022.11.02 NATO'S New Tune: "Let's Get It On"

Of course they will go on trial - just like Milosevic and Karadzic did. And like those we will see an array of medical excuses and legal arguments from these pathetic fools about why they shouldn't go to jail for the murders they ordered

Funny how Russia needed security guarantees from Ukraine concerning the Black Sea fleet before rejoining the grain deal. The chief Orc is now worried over Ukraine's ability to get to those floating man-made reef materials. Afraid of a few little toy boats? LOL

There won't be any trial of Putin. He will die in Russia. There is no way he hands himself, or the Russian people hand him over for any trial. There is no way that France and Germany allow Putin and Russia to be humiliated, and they have already said as much. The war ends with a negotiated settlement or Putin's death. Thats it, there is simply no other way. If they try him in absentia, it means nothing.

You are wrong.

@Alien
No. You want me to be wrong. In absentia, there is no chance to actively confront your accusers, challenge evidence and mount a real defense. In absentia, if Putin is still living, he sits in Russia, never leaving the confines of Russia or friendly nations who do not recognize the trial or its outcome. And thats exactly what would happen, if he is alive. Russia is never going to turn him over, and he wont turn himself in. No one is going to go into Russia and drag him out either. In a negotiated peace, there will be no trial or war crimes prosecution as part of the settlement. Don't believe in a dream trial like the Orc supporters believe they are winning, because those are just dreams that simply are not coming true.

I'm sure there are a few in the west who don't want Murderer Putin and Lavrov on the witness stand. They should be ignored - the people of Bucha deserve justice

....but one can fairly sure say that was the end of the big proud victory parades with international participation!

What a downfall....

"I told you" is not evidence. Evidence is what you would be allowed to use in a court of law.

OK, let's assume that your "unreliable vote tallies" were made reliable, a million UN observers were observing everything, and the nearest Russian soldier was 1000 miles away.

The question is: Would the referendum result be NO? As in: No, we do not want to join Russia.

The question is binary so no essays, please.

hmm assume a bunch of things that objectively happened didn't happen....They didn't happen so it's pointless to speculate... (if we're gonna be all "court of law")

Unidentified armed soldiers were milling around so that invalidates the legality of any "referendum" held in 2014 and the result of an illegal referendum is irrelevant.

Why is that so hard to understand?

Absolutely it would be no - in a free and fair election, who the hell would want to join that toilet ? Apart from the 24 hour sushi bars and plentiful supply of sprats what does Russia have to offer anyone ?

putin's conviction, even in his absence, would be a great success for the international community.

The point is that all the claims about the evil Russian army are merely lame deflection. The referendum was valid since it truly reflected the will of the people.

All the claims of intimidation and miscounting are moot as the outcome would be the same without them.


Hey, genius, did you notice Post 218?

You have no proof which way they would vote in a free and fair election. That is because no such thing as taking place in Russia since the late 1990s. The alcoholics who live there I've never been asked their opinion and if murderers like Putin have their way They never will be

Speculation.

After Crimea is returned to Ukraine and had ten years of reconstruction maybe a real referendum could be held.

You not only have no proof that they they would vote NO. Other than your attitude, you don't even have a basis to speculate that they would NO.

On the other hand, I do have a basis to claim that they voted according to their wishes and previous polls. Duh! Like this:

From Wikipedia:

The United Nations Development Programme conducted a series of polls in Crimea between 2009 and 2011 about the question of leaving Ukraine and joining Russia with a sample size of 1,200:

Quarter Yes No Undecided
2009 Q3[34] 70% 14% 16%
2009 Q4[34] 67% 15% 18%
2010 Q1[35] 66% 14% 20%
2010 Q2[35] 65% 12% 23%
2010 Q3[35] 67% 11% 22%
2010 Q4[35] 66% 9% 25%
2011 Q4[36] 65.6% 14.2% 20.2%

But, of course, according to PF morons none of that matters.

Hey, genius, did you notice the numbers in the first column - from 65% to 70%?

Since English is not your primary language, "The United Nations Development Programme" is not the same as the KGB or the FSB.

You have no proof they would vote YES in a non-fixed phony russian operation.

We'll just have to wait until some years after Crimea is returned to its rightful place in Ukraine to try a real referendum....

You have no proof that they voted contrary to their true wishes.

Providing that proof is your obligation as the complaining party and the accuser. Duh!

Interesting how soviets invaded 80 years ago and new generations still remember it and hate Russians. This is stalin's legacy. And this is what relations with Ukrainians would look like 80 years in the future. This will be putin's legacy.


I love the whole Russian\vatnik " poor Russia is a victim of the Ukrainians " card

Its more unconvincing than colonialism arguments for problems in African

Irrefutable facts are irrefutable, Russia lied and invaded a country because that country didn't want to align with Putin's restoration of the failed Soviet era borders. Putin thought that the people of Ukraine had no sovereign right to decide their own future.

Yes of course I know who the UNDP is. Worked with them several times in the past during the Marriott brigade days. I even knew a few Russian dudes there, needless to say two of them were what you might euphemistically call problem drinkers.

UNDP generally concern themselves with things like child poverty, building Wells, contraception etc. really surprised that they would suddenly start commissioning polls on matters of national sovereignty between two member states

And indeed a simple Google of "UNDP Crimea Russia polll 2012" brings only two results, one fake news site and your Wikipedia entry.

So I strongly doubt that these polls ever took place, they are just the normal fake propaganda that you guys dream up in between bouts of acidic Nicaraguan coffee and stale donuts

Can you please stop posting fake news on this website. This is not somewhere where we accept the handiwork of Russian trolls.

You're accusing the world of ignoring a valid referendum. You need to prove it's valid for your charge to carry any weight.

The entire idea that polls can replace actual votes/elections is laughable. We know from experience that polls can widely vary from the eventual election results. That is especially true for countries that experienced a lot of turmoil over the years. Imagine if the British government had said 6momths before the Brexit referendum: Polls have shown a majority for remain throughout the years including now, that is as valid as an actual vote.

People and Putin assumed that there was big public support for Russia's invasion in Eastern Ukraine based on past election results and language lines. Instead those people fought tooth and nail against the invaders.