Poland`s aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 9

While long winded at times, this is an excellent interview. Vlad has an incredible recall of Russian history, and gave a lot of insight into recent Russian history. I am doing my own research on some of his claims, and so far, everything he claimed happened, did happen the way he described it. Of course he has his own slant on things, but historically everything in checking out. If as he claims, Ukraine actually signed of on many parts of a peace plan in Turkey initialling the documents, and then changed their mind after Johson told them not to siogn it, then I have less respect for Z and Ukraine politicians. When you have a large part of a peace plan agreed upon, you do not walk away. If you do, then you are killing your own men needlessly. Anyone saying Vlad doesnt come across well is a fvcking moron. I expected someone a lot less polished, and this person clearly has his position well argued whether you agree with it or not.

Russia did not commission the interview. Thats total bull$hit.

@PolAmKrakow

That is your mistake. That you take anything Putin says at face value. He is a liar. Nothing he says about Ukraine can be trusted.

That Tucker gave him enough room to go back in history hundreds of years, but did not press him on the treaties Russia signed within the last few decades is telling.

Quite.

Some people are easily taken in by crass PR.


Rather like him reading out one of his nutty essays, probably relayed to him through an earpiece and of course the whole thing was a sermon by a war criminal, conducted on his terms. The 'interviewer' was irrelevant since it was basically a speech.

Some people are very easily taken in. Born followers craving a slick leader.

Did he bring up Bucha? The theater full of children? Attacks on civilian infrastructure? Torture of POWs?

Or are you just becoming a russian shill like russell?

Are you for real? It is Moscow's spin on that history, a political narrative not some set in stone golden truths. Just wake up will you?

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With Tucker, there is that problem he is more about US internal policies than international affairs.
It shows how little the Russian war on Ukraine is taken seriously by the US and this shows the relative position of Russia. Apart from all those propaganda speeches the US takes Russians lightly as a nuisance more than a threat.

All three of you can fvck off. I dont take anyone or anything at face value. I do my own research and am a free thinker. Bucha has to be answered for. So do a whole lot of other things. That is in the details. The big picture though is what needs to be addressed first.

Z made a presidential order that there would be no negotiations with Russia. Russia says it is ready to talk. Russia backed out of Kiev as part of a plan to start those original peace talks, Ukraine signed off on large parts of a settlement, and then Johnson got Z to back out of it. These are all public facts you and I can find on google.

Being realistic, Ukraine is not going to get Russia to give back any land it claimed. The best they can hope for is a neutral zone. Ukraine without an unbelievable amount of weapons from the US, weapons the US is running low on, has zero hope of taking back Crimea. Crimea should have been the target from the beginning and they should have had a full mobilization to take it. Z refuses to mobilize. Even if the US somehow got all these billions in weapons to Ukraine they dont have enough men to effectively use them. So WTF are they doing? Time for all the dying to stop.

Are you talking to me?

Name agreements that russia has kept.... I'll wait.

So you claim, yet you do not seem to bother verifying any of Putin's claims.


Under which conditions?


You are so gullible. Russia suffered a humiliating defeat, losing hundreds of armored vehicles and tanks and had to withdraw hastily, while losing even more equipment.


Those are not facts. Those are Putin's twisted narrative of what actually happened. Far more credible sources have denied those claims in the past, like the former Israelian PM who was present at those negotiations.

businessinsider.com/israel-bennett-walks-back-claim-west-blocked-ukraine-russia-peace-deal-2023-2


Fighting off the Russian army, destroying literally thousands of Russian tanks, more than a hundred Russian planes and almost two dozen ships by conservative estimates. Yet you seem to believe they are not taking this seriously.

You can only make peace with your enemies. If you dont talk, you cannot make peace. Easy concept to understand or not? If not please re-read. I have spent the last few hours researching Putins claims. Of course they have his twist on things. Just as Z puts his twist, and Biden does his. Every politician spins. The general facts, and basic information is all public information. Take away the spin, and you have facts. How you view them is up to you and not those idiots presenting the spin.

As for past deals. How many of them have the US, NATO and Europe broken over the centuries? Lots of them. I am willing to bet none of you watched the full interview, and only look at clips from other news outlets.

The fact that multiple points on a peace deal were agreed to in Turkey is indisputable. This happened well before Bucha or any other war crimes. There is a document with hand written initials on it. The fact that after Johnson visited with Z in Ukraine, Z backed out of all peace talks is also well documented. Z made a presidential decree banning peace talks with Russia. These are all facts easily confirmed.

So, if Z wants peace, and wants to keep more Ukraine men from dying, why not at least try to negotiate? Lift the presidential decree? Getting C,D, and L back is not going to happen. Its over. Ukraine cannot push Russia out to the old borders, it is simply impossible from a weapons and manpower perspective. So, why TF will Z not negotiate for his people so they can stop dying? And why TF would any of you continue to advocate for more war? The war is at a stalemate. Without massive US aid, there is absolutely zero chance to take back any land. Forcing your own people to fight a war they cannot win, should also be a crime.

Googling?

Nothing Putler said is new and nothing has been changed by this propaganda exercise masquerading as an online 'interview'.

An interesting thing that happened only after the internet was to expose what governments in conflicts tell the outside world vs what they tell their own people. Take the Palestinians... for years they were telling the world in English they just want their human rights... meanwhile their Arabic language media was as "We have to kill all the Jew!" Which has been a better predictor of Palestininian actions?

Do you follow russian media monitor at all? the message from government controlled media is clear and consitent and in line with what russia actually does....

They've made it clear time and time again, any temporary 'peace' is to be used to rest, rearm and attack again. They don't think Ukraine should exist and on their own they won't give up until it doesn't. they have to be beaten back and defeated.

They also don't want the Baltics to exist and are fairly confident that NATO will find excuses to let them take the three back.

They also want to subjugate Poland. Again they're extremely consistent about that.

I don't care what putain said in a stage-managed interview conducted for foreign consumption. No one who takes it seriously is informed about what's happened and will happen.

I care about what russia actually has planned and what they tell the russian publica is probably a better indication of that. And it's very clear that they want to kill as many Ukrainians as they need to.

Find this wonderful message of peace in russian media... I'll wait.

Including this one?

twitter.com/victoriaslog/status/1755884045852930109

Why is the english voice over translation removed? I dont understand any Russian so I am lost there. But yes, in the original interview, I noticed the strangeness of the interpretation. That doesnt mean I believed it. As I said, the interview was very long winded at times. Everyone has their own view of history. The US version of WW2 is quite different than Europes or Russia's. Ask the average American and they think that the US liberated all of Europe.

People, Russians, can say and hope and dream about taking Europe back. It doesnt matter. We all know it is not possible and wont happen. So rhetoric aside, lets just look at facts. Every EU country should have been building its armies for the last 40 years and they didnt. Is that Russia's fault? No. And if Russia was the real threat, why not build the military for the last 40 years?

@jon357
What part of FO didnt you understand?

How is this thing about Turkey and Boris Johnson and these "hand written initials" indisputable?

I haven't seen it confirmed in any credible newspaper.

Boris, a huge gossip around London and a former journalist, has never let that slip in any conversation

That is not how a forum works. Either engage in a discussion or leave. Nobody forces you to stay here, but don't expect other users to leave BS unchallenged.


Because we deluded ourselves in thinking that cooperation with Russia was possible, and that its' leadership had - like the rest of Europe - left imperialistic thinking behind and moved on.

In that sense Tuckers' interview was actually helpful, because it gave inrefutable evidence that no, Putin has not moved on, he has the same views as the Tsars in the 19th century. Usually we pointed to his essays, but naturally those were ignored. But anyone who admitted to watching this interview can no longer ignore Putin's own words when called out on.

For many years Russia was giving the impression of changing it's ways. The last few years proved it is not so.

First, claims about massacre in Bucha should be supported by judically correct witnessing. There is question why "dead corpses" shown in video, that based on external temperature and estimated death time should be much less pretty and hard to pass by without gas mask is appear as fresh as live, and one is started to move after filming car is drive by... And second question - why even names of "victims" is not oficially reported (fcuk off to those who will mention "reporter investigations" published).

As we tell about this stuff - "no victim - no case".

But Bucha "performance" was used to explain to western public why no peace deal can be made after Johnson visit.


Using ukrainian mens deaths (and now womans as well) to inflict as many damage to Russia and siphon as many money from US/EU taxpayers pockets to MICC. Every day of conflict - extra bloody money in someone's pockets.

As smart people say - "Ukraine's role in this conflict is to kill itself to death against Russia, causing as much damage as possible".

But Americans would not be Americans if they did not try to make money even on the extermination of the Ukrainian population.

Because there is no such thing as "credible newspaper" nowadays. And "lie by omission" art is so well polished on the West, so hard to expect to see anything that goes agfainst MSM owner's agenda.

Meanwhile in the real world...

References to Carlson's interview with Putin have disappeared in Western search engines

Russian users, when asking for "interview", are immediately given a hint, which can be used to go to viewing the conversation between the president and an American journalist. In Western search engines, the picture is just the opposite.

The same query, for example, from Paris or any other European city, does not give any hints and mentions Putin's interview with Carlson. And even with a full context query in English.

If you simply type the interview into a search engine, Google gives a 4-5 minute piece taken out of context, or something relevant, but not a two-hour video that garnered tens of millions of views in the first 24 hours.

No they haven't.


Tough.

r*SSia is an enemy of Poland, of the free world and of humanity.

Your deranged rants in favour of them (such a change from a few months ago when American right wingers weren't creaming their panties over Putler) are worth laughing at and addressing.

Just tried via VPN to run search from Barcelona. Immediately moved from .com to .es page and was unable to find link to actual complete video on Carlson site or elsewhere on a first five pages of results. Just some unrelated cr@p.

So sad that the internet in Spain isn't as free as it is in..... russia?

Go to YouTube

Type in Tucker Interview

You will be able to see the full interview plus lots of analysis and excerpts

At least that is what happened in Poland - I wouldn't be surprised if it were unavailable in Udmurtia as it makes Putler look a fool

It would.

It's not blocked though and there's plenty of coverage of Putler's silly speech.

youtube.com/watch?v=fOCWBhuDdDo&pp=ygUbdHVja2VyIHB1dGluIGZ1bGwgaW50ZXJ2aWV3

Here you are Velund - 2 hours of Putler talking freestyle to Tucker - bring a comfortable cushion for the first 40 minutes of drivel

Apparently there's already disappointment among putainites that it wasn't the hit they were hoping for.... Americans arent' interested in things that happened in russia hundreds of years ago.... who knew?

And apparently among the


Was it in this interview that he said that Zelenskyy's father fought the nazis in WWII? (nb Zelenskyy's father was born in 1947.....)

Same in the U.K.

It's just a creepy dictator moaning about historical whatever on the internet.

If he had a toothbrush moustache, a silly uniform, an torchlight procession and banged his arm down in a comical way it might get better ratings.

Next time he should get Leni Riefenstahl to direct it (if President Zelenskyy's father can travel back in time she can travel forward) or maybe film it next to Lenin's corpse.

@PolAmKrakow

I disagree

1. Putin correctly talked about Duchy of Lithuania taking over ex-Rus lands that were decimated by the mongols (Instead of saying that Poland did it, which was interesting)

2. He claimed Poland collaborated with Nazi-Germany over Czechoslovakia (Poland took Cieszyn in a huge blunder out of pettiness for what the Czechs did during Polish-Bolshevik war). While ignoring that pilot aces such as Frantisek came to Poland to take up the fight with Germany and that Poland offered safe haven to those wanting to fight Nazi Germany.

3. He insisted that originally German lands (talking about Danzig and the Danzig corridor that became Gdańsk after ww2) So he continues the narrative indirectly of modern day Poland's western borders should belong to Germany.

4. He continues the narrative that Ukraine bombed Donetsk, and that it wasn't bombed by Russian army in a intelligence agency operation to frame Ukraine.

He also goes on to portray Poland as a villain in most possible scenario's. However it seems more like just parroting what he has learned. It's not as hard core stance as in 1930-1991 Soviet Union perspective.

Still can conclude that he is still rather hostile to Poland and tries to question Poland's sovereignty while hypocritically saying he has No business or interest in Poland unless Poland attacks Russia.

We all know he will come up with some No sense when it suits him when he wants to invade Poland. Just as he did with Ukraine, when his favorite man got toppled. He really thinks people forget his men's attempts at poisoning several politicians in Ukraine is forgotten?