European News and Poland Thread 2

@BB, yeah, I don't envy Polish border guards these days (and their families)...

Btw, Polish border guards, soldiers and Territorials have been joined in as of today by police counter-terrorism units. End of joking time...

Why isn't Poland asking for Frontex? They could help.....

if the EU wishes to help with protecting the Polish-Belarussian border it could pay a share in the planned border wall

12,000 there apparently. I don't see this situation getting better any time soon.

How? Wouldn't they just expedite their transfer to Germany? Is _that_ what you want?

Frontex could help with the pushbacks.....

Spiegel writes also Europol and even NATO wait for a signal!

spiegel.de/ausland/polen-eu-kommission-will-frontex-an-die-grenze-schicken-a-19fa4a85-e9d8-4d33-899c-9e13c924579d

They are sending 8000 Territorial Defence soldiers to the border. That's rather disturbing. Professional Army, Border Guard and Police are so far conducting their duties admirably, without unnecessary escalation. With amateur TD it might not be so rosy; it won't take long before some part-time rambo's nerves break and shots will follow. Mark my words. They should keep amateurs out of it.

Hopefully they'll take that into account and manage the situation, especially any rules of engagement.

8000 more makes 20,000. Sooner or later it'll be almost a human chain.

Border with Belarus is over 400km long, so I wouldn't say "human chain", especially that forces will have to rotate - it will never be 20,000 at the same time.

Anywat, it costs a lot of money to deploy that kind of force, pay for quarters, food and extra "action egagement" wages etc. so it would be nice if EU chipped in (all the migrants want to go to Germany anyway, so).

It would cost a lot less to fly drones with machine guns. After a dozen dead, the invasion would be over.

I was being ironic. Nevertheless, there will be a lot of people at the border. Not quite a human chain, but a huge presence.


For sure; doubtless they've considered that, however it''s perhaps the least worst option.


It would, however it's worth remembering that the PiSuarzy have done their level best to **** off the EU regarding money this year and aren't easy people with which to co-operate.

@Novichok

We haven't fallen as low as to shoot civilians, among whom are women and children. The most aggressive ones will be caught and imprisoned, as for the rest tear gas, shields and police clubs should be enough. We cannot strip Poland of too much police, hence the army for the help (not for shooting civilians).

@jon357

Quite right. With PiS government it is certainly less likely to receive substantial EU help, but in this case the Union should consider it anyway.

Nor I hope will we ever.


I suspect they will do their best to avoid that too.


Especially as Bąkiewicz's fascist march may well happen illegally this week.

Yes, you have. During the Warsaw Uprising, Germans tried to use civilians as human shields. The AK had to decide if to fold or fire. They correctly decided to fire and the Germans stopped using Polish civilians as shields. See how simple things can be?

But the touchy-feely whites still operate under the "if even one" rule and that "every life matters". That's how you lose wars and that is how WW2 would be lost if not Dresden, Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and hundreds of less known targets where "women and children" died in large numbers.

The war with the invading hordes is deadlier now because they don't carry guns or their IDs to make deportations impossible.
And it is insidious - like death by a million cuts.


Then the whites will die by drowning in the sea of hostile foreign scum. The reason it will not happen to me in my house is that I am armed and have no legal obligation to interview those who would break into it. Or support them.

How many did you invite to live with you?

@Novichok

You're overreacting and your WW2 analogies are rather imprecise, to put it mildly. The border-action will be conducted professionally (if they keep TD rambos under control, that is) and without unnecessary victims.

There is an easy solution to that and nobody has to die for.....just ending the welfare....only food and clothes as long the application for asylum is running...if that news spread that movement will stop.

These people don't want to come to Germany for the nice weather or our sunny disposition after all....

@BB

Exactly! Remove the reason for coming to Germany, and the hordes will disappear. :)

No. They can work off the books and off crimes. You do have banks that can be robbed, don't you? How about dealing in drugs and prostitution?

How about selling "insurance" to store owners? How about human smuggling? How about give me your wallet or I will slash your throat?


No, it will not. MS-13 in the US is a criminal organization and they are doing just fine without 8-5 jobs or welfare. Plus there are always the NGOs with stupid women dispensing food and diapers - just as some NGOs "rescue" Africans and bring them to Europe via Italy.

You got better, BB, but still not enough.

Stop that! I feel like in school....

@Novichok

Why don't they want to come to Poland then? Surely they could form their mafias here and conduct their criminal activities. Perhaps the generous German welfare system is a key factor after all?

"Surely they could form their mafias here and conduct their criminal activities."

lol imagine if a bunch of ms 13 or mexican gang bangers came here like to where i live which is a hood stare polesie in lodz where there are drug dealers everywhere and ultras or hooligans and they started fighting for turf with them here but brought in guns? Would the polish groups arm themselves and it would become a big war zone like latin america or just be taken over and not run anything anymore or be their puppets?

@Strzelec

Well, let's hope we'll never find out.

It would become a small one and the smart guys would take all their money.

Even in places like Praga Jon. WOuld they join forces even though they have huge cultural differences? Lets say they were repatriated to praga neighbourhoods in warsaw. what do you see the result?

In any case, Lucuntshenka is doing this because he hopes it would induce the EU to lift the sanctions for his cooperation in ending the crisis. If he sees that it's not working and the Union imposes even more sanctions then he might reconsider his actions.

What Poland should do now is to completely stop letting in all the cargo trucks from Belarus and Russia (Lucuntshenka wouldn't do this without Russian support). If they calculated the daily cost of that, they would probably end the silly "hybrid-war" right away.

All hings now on Poland! If Poland stays strong and keeps them away then Lukashenkos plan is nullified....but if Poland does what Hungary plans, making a "corridor" to Germany, we are busted!

Right now Merkel (who still thinks and says she has done everything right in 2015) has no power anymore and the new gov is not yet in power (the negotiations can take some more months)...not to forget that part of the new gov will be the crazy GREENS who openly talked before about allowing more immigration....nuts!

PS: But I could understand Poland if they would want to show the finger to Berlin and Brussels....that would be a great opportunity!

@BB

We are not bringing all the forces to the border to neglect our duty of guarding the Union or to fall for some "corridor" tricks. Historically, we don't like corridors. ;)

However, the border with Lithuania might need extra guarding too (that's another 100km). Lithuanians lack our resources and apparently some migrants are coming through via the Lithuanian-Polish border.

Stop the cargo trucks, impose more sanctions - that should do the trick. But we hear voices from European Parliament that those people should be let-in in and dealt with in civilised manner - that's incomprehensible in the current situation.

You know.....you then should ask for support? They are all waiting for a signal.....I only hope it's really meant for securing the border....not taking in asylum applications....

Idiots who have learned nothing over the last five years and who are not capable of learning anything... probably ever. Ignore them.

@BB

Frontex? They have 1300 operatives altogether, and could probably only spare a part of them. No point. More various forces means worse coordination.

At the moment Border Guard estimates that there are 3-4 thousand migrants in the close proximity of our border, and probably no more thab 20,000 in Belarus, waiting to be sent in next "waves". We will soon have 20,000 forces at the border - no worries, we got this covered.

@mafketis

They will be ignored indeed (but their stupidity is overwheming).