Poland - Serbia etc. thread

This was just an attempt to placate their future victims and the international communities. The Serbs rounded up all men and young boys and executed them just for belonging to a different nationality. That is genocide, no other way to see it. And who knows what would have happened to those who were initially spared for this cynical reason if the Serbs had stayed in power later on. Not to mention the many rapes commited on those who were "spared".

They executed boys who were not even 12 years old.

youtu.be/ymf5p3LbCAE

Tell it how it really was, I am fed up to my back teeth with this Serbian propaganda and lies.


Yeah, defend that Crow......

This was genocide, committed by Serbs.

Except behind them was Kosovo. Where the Serbs still terrorized the local population. Which thankfully ended a few days after the battle, when the Serbs surrendered and Kosovo became finally free.

In fairness, Kosovo wasn't like Bosnia. The KLA were no saints, and Kosovo was a corrupt hellhole in the late 80's.

It's not to justify what the Serbs did there, but when you consider that even Carla Del Ponte pointed the finger at the KLA for organ harvesting, it's hard to take sides.

Not really, it is always easy to take the side of the opressed, especially if a certain troll is constantly degrading them.

I am far from downplaying the crimes of KLA, but it is obvious that they were justified in their goal (if not all of their means), in which they sometimes erred, as any resistance organization does.

I am in general not a fan of military intervention, because they often make things even worse (or at least not better) and are very expensive. Nevertheless we can be very proud off how we pacified the Balkans. The region has now enjoyed 2 decades of peace, democracy is getting more and more established, and the nations are slowly reconciling. Once Serbia and Kosovo have officially recognized each other, which will happen in the next few years, this process will be finished.

No, I don't agree. Look at what happened:

Slovenia - fair enough, no lasting consequences there.
Croatia - a lot of refugees are now in Serbia as a result of Operation Storm, and their return is blocked constantly.
Bosnia - de facto partitioned, problems with refugees returning home.
Kosovo - disorderly, criminals in government, the Serb minority is still completely alienated from Kosovan society
Serbia - in the clutches of the Chinese, with lasting distrust of the West

We screwed up badly in Bosnia, and it's still a mess of a country. We still haven't solved their constitutional issues, and the issue of Croats having their own entity won't go away. Places like Mostar are still ungovernable, and the society is way more separated than it was in 1989. That's before you even talk about the complete failure of the West to actually stop the war - had the UN a real mandate to stop war in May 1992, the war would have been over before it really started. Instead, we let the war drag on, and it only ended when Clinton realised he needed an electoral boost.

NATO really made a mess of Kosovo and the Kosovan War, and I'm saying this as someone who supported the intervention. It was nice that it didn't involve significant casualties, but you still had a lot of people displaced, and Kosovo was forcibly removed from Serbia without any real legal basis to do so.

I'd stress that I'm not sure if we could have done anything better, but I don't think we have much to be proud of. Kosovo has had effective independence for 11 years now, but what have they done with it? Barely anything.

edit: I will always maintain that we should have done the right thing and kept Kosovo as part of Serbia, but with the condition that it would remain under formal UN administration but de facto under civilian control (think West Berlin here) - with the provision that it remains an integral part of the Republic of Serbia pending a final settlement. It would give both Serbia and the Kosovars the chance to decide where they want to go with it - for instance, a very loose confederation.

Wasn't it specifically Germany that screwed up by recognizing the Bosnian government far too soon (and giving the Serbs no reason to not fight)?

Far in the future, when we are all long no more, among rare things time would remember would be that western Europe made its gravest historical mistake when joined effort to destroy Yugoslavia.

Soviet Union was defeated. Communism collapsed.
Russia wasn`t on the scene.
Yugoslavia wanted to joined EU.
All Slavic and eastern European countries wanted to join EU. Even Eurasian new states wanted in EU.
With time, even Russians would want to join the EU. They actually wanted already.
Western Europeans had Slavs where they wanted them thru all history. Slavs were cornered and in 100 years Slavs would be practically peacefully assimilated. All Eastern European and Slavic wast resources would belong to magnates of western Europe to control.

Then, Serbia tried to strengthen within Yugoslavia and by that to have bigger impact on that what is Yugoslavia.

To that, western Europe responded stupendously and with utter violence and savagery. Western Europe wanted to erase Serbs. Local Nazis, Nazi-Muslims and Wahhabi mafia Muslims were raised, in regions where western Europe had influence in former Yugoslavia, in Croatia, Bosnia, Herzegovina, Kosovo, Metohija. Yugoslavia started to collapse. Alliance with Islamic league was even forged against Serbs. Clinton involved even US against Serbs. NATO and EU side by side with Arabs fighting Serbs. Serbs were an masse decapitated by worse Arab mujaheedines, bombarded by NATO with depleted uranium. EU was involved in human organ trafficking of Serb captives. NATO was used to transport mujaheedines. Even UN were manipulated for transport of mujaheedines. Propaganda machinery was moved against Serbs. Finally, entire NATO was mobilized to attack what remained from Yugoslavia and Serbia. Last of Yugoslavia died. Serbia was partitioned. Kosovo turned into hell hole of Europe and world, nightmare of narco mafia and extended hand of ISIS in the heart of Europe.

That was when magic was over and EU killed as dream. Today, most of Slavs would agree that western Europe wants to use Slavs, destroy them, assimilate them, control them. All Slavic patriots, no matter Catholic, Orthodox, Protestants or atheists would tell you that deep in their heart they feel how is EU and western Europe unmasked as just another phase of `Drang Nach Osten`. Even non-Slavs of Eastern Europe, Europe and Eurasia starting to hate EU.

In the meanwhile all went wrong around EU, western Europe, NATO, USA. All world, country after country, power after power, person after person, all coming to side with Serbs.

Serbians. They did it. Their resistance. They bought new chance to Slavs. To all Slavs. After all, they did unmask EU, didn`t they?

That will history remember.

Racowie. Last Sarmatians. But finest.

Do I feel pride? First I feel all suffering that my people endured and still enduring.

Yes, but the damage was done by recognising Croatia and Slovenia first. The recognition of Croatia in particular was a boneheaded and stupid move, and it seemed that Germany didn't really understand how difficult it would be to separate Croatia from Yugoslavia then.

They were a bit more sensible with Bosnia, but from a legal point of view, Bosnia couldn't become an independent state without the consent of the Serbs. Their constitution at the time made it clear that any change to the status of the country required consent from all three major ethnic groups, and even the referendum itself didn't achieve the constitutional majority required.

I don't have much time for how the West handled the dissolution of Yugoslavia in general. Croatia in particular should have been told to get lost, as the way they behaved after the 1990 elections showed that they couldn't be trusted with the Serb minority. Same story in Bosnia - it was clear that a majority Bosniak-Croat alliance would undermine the Serbs.

I think the other naive mistake that the West made was equating Serbs in Croatia/Bosnia with Serbs from Serbia.

It surprises me that people still criticize a decision that has been so widely vindicated by history. Not only was it in line with Western policies that encouraged other people to break away from the dominion of authorian dictatorships, particulary in the Warsaw pact. It also ensured that Croatia became a firm Western ally and an important stabilizing factor in the region. Not to mention that it merely predicted an inevitable development. Croatia would have become independent either way, but this decision made it our ally and preserved our moral integrity. Another misconception is that some more understanding towards Belgrade would have prevented some of their later transgression. This completely misread the nature of the Milosevic regime. Serbia was acting as a rogue state under Milosevic, and it only caved in after being forced to do so. Remember, some of the stuff Crow likes to write here were part of Milosevic's ideology. The only real mistake was not to supply Zagreb with military assistance after the recognition, which likely would have ended the war sooner and more decisively.


Well, firstly, the Balkans have never been a good example of good governance. But considering how many different nationalities are still mixed together there, it is quite an achievement that the killings have stopped and that there is currently no real threat of violence. Slovenia and Croatia have developed remarkeably. Even things in Kosovo are slowly turning around, with the newly elected president having already introduced some widely-praised reforms against corruption and nepotism. Again, it is far from perfect, but those things take time. Just keep in mind how inefficient and corrupt e.g. Greece and Rumania are, and those countries have the benefit of peace far longer.


This would have been the worst possible solution. We likely would have faced a continued resistance movement, but against Nato forces who were stationed to keep the peace there. It is worth remembering how widely hated the Serbs were in Kosovo, so much that the Nato forces were at a time mostly occuppied with opressing anti-Serbian sentiments against people. Now with the looming Serbia-Kosovo border agreement, there will no doubt be also a solution for the minorities on both sides of the border, similar to the solution we have with Germany and Poland. That should put the issue finally to rest.

Again, it is far from perfect, but considering the limited ressources we invested, the results are quite satisfactory. Even more so if the peace proves to be lasting. Think about it, we might have permanently pacified the ME of Europe, and to little cost for us.

Same was in Croatia, by Croatian and Yugoslavian constitution. This is the thing many people don`t understand. They think term Croatia is term for Croat/Hrvat but truly, Hrvat is Austrian invented term for Catholic Serbs. So, it is open question of identity. Nation still wasn`t and isn`t consolidated and completely separated from Serbian identity. Germany wanted to finalize them as Croats and by that to finalize their germanization. Vatican supported that for its own reasons (always find reason to support German ideas).

BUT (!), most importantly, before Yugoslavia was created, one state was formed from regions of collapsed Austro-Hungaria. State wasn`t internationally recognized. Name of state was State of Slovenians, Croats and Serbs. See? That state was what is now Bosnia, Herzegovina, Croatia, Slavonia, Slovenia, Dalmatia, Serb Krajina within AH. All regions were previously part of AH. That state joined to Serbia and Montenegro to form Kingdom of Yugoslavia. If Serbia didn`t accept that, regions of that state would be split between Italy, Austria and Serbia (as Entente powers offered to Serbia). Also, region name Banat, Backa and Baranja existed already in AH as Serbian autonomous region within AH. That region on plebiscite joined to Serbia on its own after AH ceased to exist.





Offered to Serbia after WWI by Entente powers >>>



That is why Serbs were constitutive factor in later Croatia and Bosnia-Herzegovina. Serbs were local natives that had their own reasons to exist in Yugoslavia with their fellow Serbs and they had legal right to do so. This was negotiated by Serbia and Slobodan Milosevic. But Germany and EU invented story of `Greater Serbia` and prematurely recognized Croatia, Slovenia and Bosnia-Herzegovina. It gave signal to local Nazi ustashe and Muslim extremists which then attacked local Serbs. Civil War started. Rest is history.

See? See now? Not only that Croat identity is disputed- they are nothing but Catholic Serbs but, anyway, that what is Croatia was also inhabited equally by Orthodox Serbs. In Bosnia, too. Not to say how are Bosnian Muslims nothing but Islamized Serbs.

Still, official Serbia never insisted to prove how are Croats and Muslims Serbs. It is another process (and in Serbia, Milosevic is considered traitor for that by many). So, Slobodan Milosevic was Yugoslavian legalist. He wanted, if must be so, Yugoslavia to dissolve peacefully in negotiations. Considering he was right, Germany acted to sc*** Serbia and be the judge of borders on Balkans. EU followed Germany into that and later NATO.

@Crow

All that time and efffort put into that post...... and we don't care.......and you STILL haven't noticed that we don't care.....I didn't even bother to read your post and I bet most people on here did the same.... why have you wasted over 10 years on here?

Think of him (like Rich and JR) as children desperate for attention that they misbehave because even negative angry attention is better than being ignored.

Freeze him out rather than try to debate his infantile nationalism talking points.

Why are you then against Serbs? Or you aren`t?

Good advice.

Better to freeze then grill.

Serbian Army
youtube.com/watch?v=dOT8Lr3AQzE

Really? As in...REALLY????

In song. In artistic sense. You like it?

The Prussian in me disagrees...You DON'T wax about it lyrical, you DO it!

I didn't watch it.
We Poles don't care.
Maybe one German watched it.
Maybe.....
You are wasting your time......

@Bratwurst Boy

Do you know that Winston Churchill, prior to WWI and prior to coming to power said how //citation// ``In Europe exists to ideas that needs to be destroyed. One is Prussian and one is Serbian. We are now under way to destroy Prussians and then we have to deal with Serbs.``

Think about it. ``Good`` Winston had his reasons in both cases but, certainly he knew where are fire-steels.

No, I didn't know that...do you have a link to that Churchill quotation?

Please reference this supposed quote from Churchill.

Hardly. Tried. Maybe once. In the meanwhile, take it or leave it.

So can I take it that you can't qualify that quote?
Just like the rest of the propaganda BS you post on here....
Mods should permanently ban you.
I will leave it......

Searching that I founded this. Isn`t this interesting >>

Was Winston Churchill the lovechild of the King of Serbia?
sundaytimes.lk/150531/sunday-times-2/was-winston-churchill-the-lovechild-of-the-king-of-serbia-151354.html



You questioning me? Me? Behind whom is `Sarmatian connection`?

Here it is. Its info by respected Serbia`s political commentator Aleksandar Pavić > youtube.com/watch?v=m1VxUPouL-o /// It is on video on 31:03 and so on ///

Yeah, because you post BS and you either don't give links, or when you do they don't work.
You are just a Serb jester... useless.....
And BTW, there is no Sarmatian connection....... the Polish Sarmatian connection is largely fake.....

I started reading it. About 1/3rd through, I knew its just more of his BS and I really think he has someone helping him pump this nonsense out. Most of his posts are incoherent 4th grade level (being kind) English/gibberish and his other posts have somewhat better English and has actual paragraphs. I doesn't matter bc its all make believe.


No such thing exists at all.


When Pigs Fly! LOLOL

Serbian president speaks at World Economic Forum in Geneva >>> youtube.com/watch?v=fkvQqFmkCTU >>>

Look comment on video from 6:50, after asked by journalist >>> its about Mile Budak, Croat ustashe ideology creator (during WWII when Germany helped establishing Independent State of Croatia) that said how 1/3 of Serbs had to be killed, 1/3 converted forcefully to Catholicism and, 1/3 expelled.

Mile Budak is openly venerated in Croatia that is in fact Greater Croatia, where rules apartheid and where is evil to exist as Serbian, no matter are those Serbs Orthodox or Catholic. Bosnian Muslim Serbs (Bosniaks) are tolerated because Vatican see them suitable to be converted to Catholicism. Plus, it has its history in Hitler`s alliance with Islam and creation of Nazi-Islam in the region. Catholic Serbs are encouraged to declare themselves as Croats. Protestantism is tolerated. Official language in Croatia is Serbian language but state there call it Croatian language. Croatia is pro-Germanic and clero-Catholic project of Germany, Vatican`s Franciscian order, Austria and Italy. For its specific interests entire western Europe had its historical role in formation of Greater Croatia. EU openly support this Greater Croatia, where grow Nazism, Nazi-Islam and extreme Catholic clericalism. It seam to be great to have such a state and project in Europe. It sending powerful message to all who aren`t Catholics or Protestants in Europe- you die if you refuse Rome. EU is this, among other things.

But hope maybe exist. On the proofs sent by Patriarch of Serbian Orthodox Church Irinej to the Pope Francis about role of beatified Stepianc during WWII in Greater Croatia, Vatican responded by stopping process of Stepinac`s canonization into saint.

youtu.be/Ph3YyOIaHBM

Medeni Mjesec - Srpska Zemljo / Serbian Land (english subs)

youtu.be/KifJ6J3KmWg

Medeni Mjesec - Ovdje žive dobri ljudi / Good people live here (polish, russian, english, german subs)

youtu.be/zyhi1LAuTQE

Sjećaću se palih drugova / I will remember my fallen comrades (english subs)