Ukraine Crisis... Poland... and the way i see it

answer the complete question

Go ask the eyewitnesses.

Are you not going to comment on the fact that the Russian education system has just been caught trying to re-write history?

Interesting comments about the way that Russian media is trying to portray events in Ukraine:


Full article is here: bbc.com/news/magazine-27713847

Yes, and I hope these brave Russians live to see a better country. I fear for their safety as do they themselves. 56 journalists have been murdered since 1992 in Russia.

cpj.org/killed/europe/russia/
Putin cannot stand dissent and looks to be President for life. Poor Russia.

good one:

"In the recent years, the West has been largely oblivious to Russia's propaganda machine, which managed to use its reach to create a league of clueless Putinistas the world over."

a trend rather visible in this thread, not entirely without its uses, if you treat the susceptibility to Russian propaganda as the litmus test for stupidity

examiner.com/list/russia-s-top-20-lies-about-ukraine

FlaglessPole, propaganda is not a one-way street. Liars are everywhere. This is no Disneyworld.

The question is simply whether or not the Russian regime are telling the truth and the rest of the world are liars, or the reverse.

Zero sum is little better than self abuse it was the inspiration for the invasions of Iraq etc remember "You are either with us or against us"' "those with nothing to hide have nothing to fear".

It is ironic to use propaganda to lambast propaganda

Barney: you're either telling the truth or you're lying.

Well, in your case you've been caught lying so many times that....

A nice piece in the British press that sums up the situation.
theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jun/06/petro-poroshenko-d-day-meeting-putin-chance-end-lethal-tug-of-war

Here is some advice for the new oligarch....


There was really no need to have the neo nazis in this junta but they were chosen cos they provided the muscle in the coup. Hopefully this new guy will see sense.

It would be nice to have people in the government not based on whose party got what percentage in the elections, but those who are qualified to perform a given job. Mr. Steele is out of touch with reality. He says: " Barack Obama and David Cameron continue their exaggerated blaming of Russia..." How can someone exaggerate in blaming Russia in the current crisis, if this country invaded Ukraine, took away part of its territory, threatens the nuclear security all over the world, sends its terrorists to Ukraine (if someone doesn't believe, there are coffins of dead Russian militants sent back to Russia). This alone testifies to the fact that this journalist has no idea of what he writes about. His grumble about everyone, but Russia and him, calling the terrorists - terrorists - is more than childish. He is quick to call political parties to be Neo-Nazis, but when it comes to those who shoot down government helicopters with the modern weapons and terrorize the local population and the whole country, the use of word "terrorist" makes him angry. Ridiculous old man.


He should nothing. He knows what to do and your advice you better address to Putler or Kim Jon Un.

Ukraine likes to get exploited by the west, let their politicians accumulate dirty money while the people live the same crap as before westerners never and will never care about Ukraine

As usual you're lying, Barney: that piece did not appear in the British press. It appears on the "Comment is free" section of the Guardian website. "Comment is free" is not the British press; comment is free is simply a blog, which is why some of the pieces appearing on it are so utterly dire.


Are you ever going to get tired of lying about a democratically elected government being a junta?


Would those be the fictional neo-nazis which you lied about being in control of so many government ministries?


One of the main problems with the Guardian's readership is that it tends to adopt default positions, just like Barney does. In this case some of the Guardian's readership supports Russia because America opposes the Russian invasion and occupation of Ukraine, just as Barney supports the Russian invasion and occupation of Ukraine because the British government opposes it.

Harry, I'm tired of you coming on here making up stories, posting your Bias opinions on everything you can, trolling people like Barney, posting propaganda. You can't have a decent discussion with people like you

Conflict in Ukraine? every action has a reaction. now that Maidan was a pointless failure Ukraine should stop killing it's people a build their country with that IMF loan instead of shelling cities that their going to have to rebuild eventually. politicians are going to have to respect all people in Ukraine by not joining E.U and NATO, abandon extreme nationalism and work on tolerance and build a new Ukrainian culture to get ready to integrate into Polish or Russian culture because I don't see how much longer Ukraine can last

Would you like to given even a single example of me making up a story about events in Ukraine? Or are you very simply lying when you claim that I do that? I wonder.


I do not troll Barney: I point out the lies which he tells here.


Since when has posting examples of you Kremlin fanboys and Russian 'media'/'journalists' being caught lying been "propaganda"? Would you like to give example of me posting propaganda? Or is your claim that I do just another lie?


Yes, all it managed was to sweep aside a vastly unpopular and utterly corrupt regime and replace it with a democratically elected government. Are you aware of what the word 'failure' actually means?


Yes, it must be hard to see things like that from Canada; however, as everybody in this part of the world can tell you, Ukraine will not be disappearing any time soon

are you going to back up your claim of "Rebels in Crimea"? that article did not even mention anything as such you pulled that out of your ass, and thats not the first time your caught lying on here



But you don't point out lies you tell, and Barney doesn't go on about it over and over again


Oligarch for an Oligarch which could have been done without Maidan = failure to many people


Its propaganda by no nothing posters and underground news outlets almost nobody reads, you posting that here acting like these are mainstream news in Russia is propaganda


Yes, your overlords are getting ready for the harvesting of Ukraine to exploit everything they have and they will be continue to be a poor country lagging behind every other country in the region besides for Moldavia

I've already done that several times here.


But you haven't caught me lying about drones in Crimea, quite the reverse: you were lying.
You claimed "it [the article] states it [the drone] was intercepted not taken down/destroyed." while the article says "It was possible to break the drone's link with its American operators with the help of the EW (electronic warfare) complex Avtobaza. As a result, the device made an emergency landing and passed into the possession of the self-defense forces almost unbroken," the report says."

voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_03_14/US-drone-intercepted-in-Crimean-airspace-Russias-state-corporation-2994/

Oops, yet again you get caught lying.


I've pointed out two of his lies about (the one about a blog being "British press" and the one about a democratically elected government being a junta). So yet again I have just pointed out another of your lies. And Barney most certainly does bang on and on and on about a democratically elected government being a junta, which means that I have just pointed out yet another of your lies.


You want to claim that Voice of Russia is not mainstream news? Oops, yet again you get caught lying.


How surprising that you 'forget' about the mafia statelet of Transnistria which your Dear Leader so supports.

Nothing here backs up "rebels in Crimea"


What kind of games your trying to play?


you are lying because I never claimed that, you manipulated the article of voiceofrussia then said its lying.
The other stuff posted is not mainstream


because I don't think about that place, and it doesn't change the fact Ukraine is now open for exploitation

There is a dog in my neighbourhood that barks at the moon........

As usual you are lying.


voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_03_14/US-drone-intercepted-in-Crimean-airspace-Russias-state-corporation-2994/


You have claimed that the article says nothing about rebels and doesn't say the drone was taken down: it actually says both those things: you have thus been yet again caught lying.

If they have the drone then good for them, If they don't then prove it

When somebody wants to make a claim, it is for them to support that claim, not for other people to demonstrate they are lying. You think that the rebels in Crimea brought down a US drone as Voice of Russia states? Let's see it then.

The reality is that the range of the drone is too limited for it to be operated from where VoR claims it was being operated and the machine which the 'rebels' claim to have used to bring it down is actually a "passive radio engineering surveillance system" "designed to detect airborne side-looking radars, air-toground fire-control radars and low-altitude flight control radars"

Not looking at all good in Ukraine.


Full article here: en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/208990.html


Full article here: charter97.org/en/news/2014/6/12/102422/


I wonder if any of our resident Kremlin fanboys dare defend the action of their hero.

Harry, quite clearly these tanks are available at any military surplus store. If somebody wanted one they could easily buy one...

That is about as believable as some of the cr@p Barney, gregy, etc come out with about Ukraine, which is quite sad really.

The most important thing to remember here is that politicians on each side want their followers angry and afraid.

"In her interview with Le Monde the writer Liudmila Ulitskaya said that the Russian mass media are manipulating the Russians' mass consciousness and have already beaten the world record in lying. In particular, the writer claims, TV channels broadcast footage from Syria and Venezuela under the guise of the events in Donetsk. The Russian intelligentsia cannot do anything as, according to her, freedom of speech in Russia is being oppressed. "

euromaidanpr.wordpress.com/2014/06/13/ulitskaya-the-russian-mass-media-beat-the-world-record-in-lies/

and then, there is the other side:
"In the face of clearly hypocritical Western lecturing - Putin's ratings at home have soared. And the people of Ukraine have also been betrayed - their push for democracy co-opted by US interests, and their economy having lost up to $80bn, according to latest reports. Will Western leaders be held to account? Probably not if this thundering and incorrect narrative continues to play out across the media. This is why Western leaders are so keen to demonise Putin - it gets them off the hook."

aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2014/05/ukraine-lies-propaganda-west-age-20145384527678726.html

youtube.com/watch?v=LP41Azok1dw

"The evil has swollen Russia and moved on to Ukraine, we couldn't stop it and I feel my guilt in it," says a middle-aged man in the video. Other people in the video also ask to forgive them for not being able to stop their authorities, say they are ashamed of their own country and wish all the best to Ukrainian nation.

kyivpost.com/content/ukraine/russians-pay-tribute-to-ukraines-slain-soldiers-post-video-on-youtube-352140.html

I asked my mother if she prefers Ukrainians or Russians. She though a bit and said: "Russians, if they didn't drink so much." ;)

Some random bum in the street asked me "Any change?". "Nope," I replied, "you're still drunk and homeless". We laughed and laughed and he stabbed me ... Flesh wound, I'm fine, yet still at the end of the day, when everything's been said and done, Putin is THE cvnt.

Putin, Obama... people that blame political situations on a man on top have very limited view of the world.