Ukraine Crisis... Poland... and the way i see it

yes,but then again,cant be sure untill you are sure.
could be Ukrainian mistake or even deliberate,not very possible but still
have you read those tweets from this spanish guy from Kiev control tower?

its a tragedy. the one responsible should be held accountable. Area is not safe, civilian planes should not fly there. they should know this because several military planes have been downed there for some time now.

Good job finding this @gregy741

This could suggest that either Russian or Ukrainian Air Forces were not updated, In the middle of civil war/conflict communication sucks.
But imho Russian Air Force would not fire on the flying plane inside Ukrainian air space.

But there are always few corridors, many of them in fact.

During Cold War during West Berlin blockade (Berlin Airlift) the Soviets granted 3 corridors to the Allied Forces each 20 km wide.
And there were no accidents, granted everybody were on high alert and the allied planes were flown by real deal air force pilots.

link: spiritoffreedom.org/airlift.html

seriously, are you really that desperate..? I derive no satisfaction from saying this, but this is becoming just too distasteful... what's sure until sure, the only sure thing is that Russians will do everything in their power to cover it up seeing as the plane crashed in their zone of control and they are the only ones having access to it, so don't worry, give it a day or two and you'll have your desired 'clarification' suiting the agenda you currently support... however the rest of the world won't be fooled by it, another certainty to consider...

youtube.com/watch?v=VnuHxAR01Jo

If this is real, then it's damning.

Very very sad.

i seen this
i have little doubts,it was rebels fault but this video is presented by SBU,so could be fake.

mashable.com/2014/07/17/malaysia-airlines-ukraine-russia-cossacks-leaked-audio/

Rebel scum murdered these innocent people.

don`t sound as like that you work for CIA Harry.

me desperate? i said 100 times that it was rebels job most probably..tho i said lets wait for investigation conclusion before blaming anyone
you in the other hand the very 1-st post regarding this tragedy was you saying-"good job Russia"
show me evidence it was Russia deliberate job?whose is spastic and using this tragedy to spawn hatred towards another nation without any proof whatsoever?

certainly not me


wow..Harry
don't remember you having have any emphaty for those Donbass people ,being murdered for months now

Ukraine: Mothers and wives of Kiev soldiers protest government

youtu.be/sbil2fx42MM

ahh
this is another issue regarding Kiev government and official Ukrainian serviceman losses .
i been reading reports from troops on ground from both sides and it appears Kiev is hiding massive losses
some reports about dumping bodies in slavansk lakes and so on.i was kinda expecting that sooner or later Ukrainian population will start those kinda protest.wait and see Yatseniuk will label those woman FSB agents

My deepest condolences to the relatives of the victims. Russia has to be subdued by the world community, otherwise these animals will be murdering people endlessly. The UN and NATO, please, send your observers and if necessary peace-keeping troops. Russia has to be stopped. Its support of terrorism crosses every possible line.

"The same way I assure you that Ukrainians who cherish and honour UPA like I do have no thought about Poles whatsoever"by Nathan

any condolences for victims of kievian animals?no?
so get lost banderist,what? you dont have nazis and Hitler to hide behind their back and kill civilians-now you want "world community" to do murdering job for you,cowards?

Sad but true.

you guys have very selective emphaty.
to this day i been in thousands dissccusions and couldnt meet 1 SINGLE western Ukrainian condemning killing civilians in east Ukraine.
not a fokin SINGLE one-all of THem had excuses-stalin bad,holodomor, russia animals and on and on.not a fokin single condolences.
now all of them full of pain and empathy.like Nathan-going from thread to thread glorifying UPA genocide,now poor victim,calling Russians"animals"that need to be subdued

for me human life is human life regardless wherever is Malaysian or Russian child.
anyway
first flight of this plane was 17/07/1997:
airfleets.net/ficheapp/plane-b777-28411.htm

yes, one that I must add, has a selective political agenda behind it


Yep, its people like Nathan that make people think all people from western Ukraine are scum.


there must be many who condemn the murders, anyone who is normal basically. What you are experiencing are ukrotrollbots. However I had the unpleasant experience of meeting a banderist from Kiev in person, so its not that uncommon.

Seems like that sort of worldview was long firmly wedged in your ill-informed psyche, all too happy to regurgitate whatever Moscow's increasingly outrageous propaganda has on offer. Fall in line soldier the official line of RT news is now that rebels didn't shoot down that plane, isn't that what you should be yelling on about here or you're getting a bit rusty?

thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/07/17/mh17-shoot-down-likely-was-a-mistake.html

"Finch was more succinct in his initial opinion. "They got something on their radar screen, and they engaged it and now they're like, "Oh ****, what have we done?'"

This is borne out by separatist leader and Russian intelligence official Igor Strelkov, who earlier today posted online "do not fly in our skies," adding that his forces had shot down a plane. After the identity of the crashed airplane became known, the Strelkov's comments were scrubbed from the web site. Separatists now deny having shot down the airliner or even possessing Buk systems, despite publicly capturing some in June from Ukrainian forces."

This is also written about here: rferl.org/content/ukraine-separatist-leader-boasts-downing-plane/25460930.html

Scum.

Putin's propaganda machine will launch a furious effort to blame Ukraine, the CIA, the U.S. State Department, or dark forces that have it in for Malaysian Airlines. It will find many conspiracy buffs to support its wild yarns. However, the true story is simple: The Russian mercenaries, having celebrated their downing of two Ukrainian air force planes, were ready for another triumph. They set their radar sights on an incoming plane which they assumed to be a Ukrainian military transport and shot it down. Within a few minutes, the separatist authorities and their Kremlin handlers knew they had shot down a civilian plane. They did not seem that shaken. As officer Kozikhin retorted: "Well the plane must have carried spies. Do they not know there is a war going on?"

RT has already tried claiming that the shootdown might have been the result of Ukraine trying to kill Putin!


However, this story was so obviously utter bollocks that even RT had to rewrite it.

just watch Barney and the rest of the krasnaya zvezda tinfoil company on here chime in on that nutjob theory... all right personal slights aside, this is much more grave, and Putin will have hard time squrming out of this one:

(Reuters) - The world of AIDS research was in a state of shock on Friday after dozens of leading experts in the field were feared killed when a Malaysian plane was shot down over Ukraine, dealing a blow to hopes of curing the disease.

Yeah I have read that yesterday, also saw on YT the video..
Joseph Goebbels would be proud of the Russian propaganda machine.

The more I think about it the more I am becoming convinced that the Russians and/or rebels were trigger happy.
Now is the time for the damage control.

RT has lost any credibility it had by pushing this nonsense. Putin's blaming Kiev is even more despicable. Russophile apologists on this website would do well to stfu for a while.

What credibility?

Today a Ukrainian intelligence unit recorded a truck carrying a missile system heading towards the border of the Russian Federation. You can clearly see the missiles and a space where one used to be, before it was used to murder 295 civilians.

youtube.com/watch?v=L4HJmev5xg0

Sara Firth, a longstanding London-based correspondent for Russia Today, resigned on Friday in protest at the channel's coverage of the Malaysia Airlines crash.

You have no justification for describing me in that way, I have made it very clear that I oppose Russian interference in Ukraine I oppose the UDI and subsequent annexation of Crimea just as I opposed the coup in Kiev. Pointing out the naked racism of some of the posters here and frankly mad conspiracy theories does not equate to me supporting Imperialism.

The accusations from mentally unbalanced posters here don't amount to a hill of beans; going round in circles with some deeply disturbed individuals who refuse to explain why people (who had been) installed in Kiev are not neo nazi when these people founded a think tank named after Nazis and so on is not my idea of fun. These same posters refuse to explain any point they make yet demand answers from others often ignoring what has been written and posting some internal ramble instead.

Perhaps the less than subtle racist slurs that you and others have posted may need addressed before you start throwing others. Posting propaganda in order to counter propaganda is really silly.

As it happens, the person who has been telling lies about neo-nazis being installed in Kiev is you Barney.
You claimed"Neo-Nazis are in Control of Armed Forces, National Security, Economy, Justice and Education the right sector and justice parties control these ministries". is clearly shown to be a lie by looking at who is actually in charge of those ministries and which parties they are from:

"National Security" would presumably be the Minister of Internal Affairs, Arsen Avakov (Batkivshchyna), not a neo-Nazi, from neither the right sector nor the Freedom party, and not from a neo-Nazi party.

"Economy" would be Minister of Economic Development and Trade, Pavlo Sheremeta (No party affiliation), not a neo-Nazi, from neither the right sector nor the Freedom party, and not from any party.

"Justice" would be Minister of Justice, Pavlo Petrenko (Batkivshchyna), not a neo-Nazi, from neither the right sector nor the Freedom party, and not from a neo-Nazi party.

"Education" would be Minister of Education and Science, Serhiy Kvit (No party affiliation), not a neo-Nazi, from neither the right sector nor the Freedom party, and not from any party.


You can't oppose it: there wasn't one. Or perhaps now you'd like to explain in what way is a self-appointed bunch of criminals announcing that an area of land is going to join another country a declaration of independence?


There wasn't one of those either; no matter how many times you repeat that Kremlin lie, there won't have been one.


You complain about other people being racist while displaying disgraceful racism yourself. Shameful.

rebels mistaken identity is most probably reason of this accident.tho,nobody have answered , why Kiev sent this jet there
here from Malaysian company,they asked Ukraine to allow them to fly at higher altitude,Kiev authorities,who control airspace refused,sry only in polish:

So what? The Buk missile which your fellow Kremlin loyalists used could reach 10,700m as easily as it reached 10,100m.


Kiev did not send the jet there: the pilots wanted to fly over Ukraine in order to get where they were going.

Lugansk today after air and artillery strikes:
Civil killed - 44 (kids -1)
Civil wounded -215 (kids 4)

Destruction:
Apartment buildings - 46
Private houses - 195
Schools -3
Kindergartens - 12
Bus station -1
Pharmaceutical warehouses - 1
Shops - 18
Including supermarkets - 3
Catering establishments - 2
60% of the city markets are closed.

Objects of the industrial sphere:

Plants - 5
Warehouse of finished goods of private enterprises - 10

City critical infrastructure:

It is damaged trolleybuses - 10
Trams - 5
Municipal buses - 3
Share taxis - 40
Contact lines of electrotransport - 10 km
Power lines - 19 km
Roadbed - 17000 sq.m.
Boiler rooms - 6
Power substations - 11
Objects of water supply - 4

any Ukrainians want to express condolences?here is your chance. or it is OK to kill "russians"?