Let's debate American Politics

They have terrorist attacks almost on a daily basis in Europe.
Jon is using this to push his agenda on us, as usual.


This is what happens when the left tries to RE- WRITE HISTORY. They even tried to omit the parts of the bible that doesn't fit into their narrative.


Lets see your bogus stats, or you making up stories again? We just had a deranged lefty shoot up a congressional baseball game and almost killed one of our Representatives.

Where was your outrage then? Oic, because he was a lefty, well just ignore some more facts again.

The Left is clearly the party of Hate, Resist and Obstruct.

@jon357

I don't hear any condemning of Muslim terror... Yes condemn it just like you condemn the car ramming in va

There is no denying a couple meth head neo Nazis whether us Europe or anywhere else have a far less body count than radical Islam.

It appears you're only singling out one group to criticize. So please condemn the terror attacks in va just as both you and I have condemned the terror attacks in va. Or are you incapable of that because that's what it appears

Antifa intimidates peaceful people too and waves losers flag. They come uninvited and assault people just as they did at nearly every trump rally. No they have murdered anyone yet surprisingly. However its bound to happen as they go to rallies just to antagonize conservatives even if they aren't neo nazis but normal hard working conservative families. They sure as hell have sent people to the er thanks to beating them with smileys.

Fyi since 2001 According to wiki there have been 68 murders associated with right wing terrorism... That's a span of 15 years - 60 people die in a week in chicago. Yet you won't condemn black gangs, you won't condemn Muslim terrorism but yet you'll go on and on about a bunch of losers who have a body count a fraction of any other violent group.

This article describes the situation in us rather well

nationalreview.com/article/450462/antifa-alt-right-twin-cancers-eating-america

The hypocrisy from the left is mind boggling!

Good News! It appears Kim Jon Fatty murdering dictator of NOKO put his tail between his legs and decided Not to attack Guam!

Trumps bold style of diplomacy has done more in 3 months than the Washington swamp has achieved in 35 years.

The thread of course is about America. Wgere the big news story of the months (except for the so-called president's actual or attempted treason with Russia) is the far-right 'summer of hate', which has already resulted in a terrorist murder.


You think that's acceptable? One is too many, and according to stats the number is increasing since Trump and his vocal far-right followers started normalising hatred.

The backlash when it comes will be spectacular.

@jon357

Why no condemnation of black gangs who murder thousands every year in my city? Why no condemnation of Islamic terror on us soil which has an exponentially higher body count. Is that acceptable?

Again it seems your only singling out one group rather than unequivocally condemning terrorism and violence. That's very biased of you. At least I'm able to condemn violence whether left right Islamic whatever which your incapable of.

So you're encouraging violence then it would seem by saying the backlash when it comes will be spectacular. What do you want, a race war? It would seem so by your comment. Unlike you, trump condemned violence from all sides - his exact words.

Ben shapiro is certainly correct when he says the cancer of alt right and antifa needs to be removed. But you don't want that. You won't condemn antifas violence or black gangs or Islamic terror.. You single out one group that has the lowest body count out of all of them

I thought you were fairly objective but your failure to condemn violence unequivocally proves you are truly biased and full of hate towards specifically conservatives most of whom hate these groups. They do not speak for us and are a tiny percent of the conservative population.

There you go again, trying to put words into people's mouths by pretending you don't know the difference between encouraging and observing.


Trying to relativise again. The issue is the far-right 'summer of hate' organised by vocal Trump supporters. One issue neither adds to nor detracts from the seriousness of the other.


There you go again - whose role is it to condemn the far-right rallies in Charlottesville? As for the 'tiny percent of the population that don't 'speak for' you, Muslims also have to say this very often, about their own even tinier percent.

@jon357

I don't hear you unequivocally condemning violence and terrorism Jon regardless of its source. Till you do you are a hater nothing more. Just reveals your true bias and hatred of conservatives even if they have nothing to do with some alt right methheads.

Spectacular is an adjective to describe something wonderful great etc. You're saying the backlash will be spectacular so one can only assume that you'll smile at the violence the left will perpetrate. Till you condemn the violence of the left as well as the other groups I mentioned we can't assume otherwise

And yes I would say thousands dying each year mostly black victims at the hands of black gangs are a far bigger problem than 68 murders over 15 years. Same with Muslim terror which has a far higher body count. Just the past few days more Muslims killed people all around the world than the far right did in the us in 15 years. However it seems you place so much more emphasis on one particular incident than the thousands of deaths caused by the other groups. You're only condemning one form of violence by one tiny group and equating it to the millions of trump voters which makes you an ignorant biased hater.

@jon357

Its trumps role to condemn it which he did. If you wish to condemn it you should say that all violence hatred and terrorism is bad and not just what a few alt right guys did. What they did is terrorism violence hatred same as what the Muslims blm groups etc have been doing.But you can't bring yourself to son that which shows how biased and unobjective you really are.

Maybe you can start by condemning the blm guy who shot some 4 5 cops in texas

There you go again, trying to put words into people's mouths by pretending you don't know the difference between encouraging and observing.


Trying to relativise again. The issue is the far-right 'summer of hate' organised by vocal Trump supporters. One issue neither adds to nor detracts from the seriousness of the other.


There you go again - whose role is it to condemn the far-right rallies in Charlottesville? As for the 'tiny percent of the population that don't 'speak for' you, Muslims also have to say this very often, about their own even tinier percent.

Excuse the double post - very slow internet here. Anyway...


Grudgingly and late. No surprises, with the far-right being his most vocal supporters.


No - it describes something dramatic and extreme - and the backlash will be just that. Extremes are followed by extremes - always.


I wonder if you think that the oppressed and poor are the same as the privileged people who are desperate to keep them dowm.

Probably not - since you're so keen to relativise the horror of torchlit Nazi processions, swastikas and all during the far-right's all-american 'summer of hate'.

@jon357

The issue is that black gangs Muslim extremists etc have a far higher body count than the alt righr ever will. Even historically commies killed way more people than the nazis ever did. The sad thing is commies idolize Karl marx who was a deadbeat father of 4 legitamite and 1 illegitimate children, a raging alcoholic who's father had to transfer him from uni to uni to try to curtail his drinking and partying, an adulterer, and hypocrite as he speculated on the stock market which he himself abhorred and instead of finding a job he forced his wife to beg her baron father for money. In the meantime he slept with another women who stayed with then in a slum house. He couldn't even provide for his own family poor sap.

Spectacular is a positive adjective. As in I did a spectacular job on my essay or I left a spectacular money shot on his wife's belly button. It conveys positivity and something great or wonderful. There are plenty of more neutral adjectives you could have chosen.

Also I'm not relativizing anything. I called both parties idiots. However facts are facts. The far right has a far lower body count than Muslims and black gangs ever well. Hence if we want to lower the amount of deaths we should focus on who causes the most - black gangs and Muslims. But you're focused on the group with the lowest body count because you are a biased unobjective hater with a specific agenda to spread. I don't tho I condemned terrorism and violence whether its from the right left Islam whatever which you STILL can't do. The va attacks Muslim terror and black gangs terrorizing my city are all occurring within the same time frame but you chose to only focus on 1 issue, 1 group.

Mount St Helens was spectacular. It wasn't particularly good for those who lived nearby...


None of those groups you try to use to relativise the horror organised the far-right 'summer of hate', none decided to hold a losers' rally in a small town, none marched in a torchlight procession with Swastikas.


Yes. You are trying to relativise the issue by comparing it to other phenomena. See above.

@jon357

Muslims marching with jihad flags and shouting Allah akbar while killing masses, blm/black panther sniping 5 cops in texas etc its all terrorism and violence which I condemned.

However I am pointing out that it is FACT that far rights commit far less violence and terrorism than muslims, black gangs, etc. So yes compared to Muslim extremists and black gangs, whose violence you still refuse to condemn, far right groups have an exponentially lower body count.

In terms of sheer scale of attacks and amount of murders, no the far right doesn't even compare to black gangs. Black gangs in chicago over 1 summer kill more people than white nationalists have over the past 30 years. Now religious Muslims of course we all know slaughter people everyday in one country or other. Everyday someone gets killed while the perp yells Allah akbar.

I think the working-class, Joe Average white male American (typically W.A.S.P., though not exclusively by any means) has started to feel marginalized within his own country and is slowly sick to death of the feeling of being overtaken by third-world immigrants brought here in boatloads because of political hanky-panky (don't forget either the eternal lure of cheap labor) along with empowered minority groups here at home, yes including women of all stripe, race, or nationality, with unconscious assumptions of privilege, often lacking in the skills needed in, say, medicine, but hired often because they are women, black doctors being hired for the same reason!

Where quality goes out the window, so does the American Dream.

Time is that USA start new war. Any. Anywhere.

Already has, fella! The War on the Middle Class started , oh, thirty-five years ago in change, when a guy named Reagan decided politics made more money that playing "Bedtime for Bonzo"!!!

Yea unless you have capital to invest even a 100K salary barely gets you a middle upper class existence in a major us city.

......which is squeezing out those equally deserving renters who can't (yet) afford to be home-buyers, much less owners, finally able to burn that little ol' mortgage and laugh in the lender's face!! When people are being excluded through not fault of their own, unwitting victims of arbitrary economic shifts, that's (as I've said umpteen times before) when mega-trouble starts a-brewin' in America!!

The engine of the US economy was chuggin' along just fine and naturally, roughly from around 1946-'47 right up though 1963-'66, thereabouts. Towards the end of the sixties, thanks to the Woodstock culture in addition to the sterling effects of the Immigration Open Quota Act of '64, winding up at the end of the '70's, all that glorious, storied prosperity was morphing into something else, something unrecognizable to the Boomer Generation. Reagan came in on the heels of these changes, a growing disillusionment with trade unionism along with "business as usual" up until that time. Suddenly, the engine which had been puttering along, was without warning, suddenly speeded up something fierce, like an amusement park roller coaster just switched into high gear and everyone's gasping for the ride to simply stop... but it doesn't and there ain't no safe way to get off.

We're bearing the sad brunt of this sea change and Trump's merely been fanning the flames of that summer of discontent on Max Yasgur's farm so long ago.

Isn't America a nation of immigrants?


"Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free"



"The wretched refuse of your teeming shore"

"Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

Looks like y'all need to demoilish a certain statue, if you no longer respect what it stands for...

All true indeed, jon, yet somehow, when one begins to "deconstruct" the shibboleths of the Ellis Island experience, one finds that for many today, those once sonorous words of Emma Lazarus have long since started to ring hollow, as many of those huddled masses ,especially from Haiti, Syria or elsewhere in the Middle East, are just a little TOO huddled and tempest-tossed for an economy, reeling from years of political mismanagement!

Sorry to sound like a cynic, but those who came here round about the turn of the last century, were all too eager to Americanize, adapt, and try their level best to "do it ON THEIR OWN", before Social Security, Unemployment Insurance and all the best of those things which we so cherish today, without realizing the hell of life before they existed. My grandparents came here in 1899 or thenabouts, and the first thing they did, was to STOP speaking either Yiddish or German and speak ONLY in English, regardless of how comical the results often were:-) Rather than receiving charity from the local shul aka synagogue, my grandfather and uncle put themselves and my grandmother through night school, later working their way up to creating a small law practice in midtown Manhattan.

The economy of that time was far different from today, and it took a far-sighted genius like an FDR to see how the government could make the human lot much better by ameliorating the conditions under which people lived, worked, and died.

I don't think that Lady Liberty has one hand holding the torch and the other flipping the bird.


The previous wave of immigrants used to complain that they didn't try to adapt. They in turn were complained about in the same way by those who came before them.

I suppose I can only speak from my experience.

The problem is now people feel as if they're so entitled and important. Were all emperors. Everyone wants to be a chief and not an indian without putting in the work. Especially the younger generations. They just want someone to put them on or become the next rapper or something. People don't feel like working hard anymore and investing over a long period of time. Everyone wants to be a millionaire overnight.

AMEN, bud, and pass the ammo on that one!! Couldn't agree more and here you are speaking many of my exact same thoughts, Dirkdiggler.

Post-'60's especially, when parents started becoming "pals" with their kids instead of responsible, if loving, authority figures as throughout time immemorial, smoking weed, hanging out etc., rather than laying down rules, albeit flexibly, this was the beginning of the end! That Woodstock Generation of dead-head space cadets equated "discipline" with "faschism" and this red-diaper dopebaby blather really gets me sick.

Nowadays, we can't tell our children anything, as they've become "empowered" by arrogance along with the misguided notion that they're somehow "perfect" just as they are.

What a joke:-)

I've read an interesting article about this somewhere, about how the old system of 'you put your time in and you get your position' has effectively completely died. The problem is that it's been replaced with a culture where corporate leaders are almost all MBA zero-hands-on-experience types who started off as consultants for McKinsey before moving to a high position in some corporation. As a consequence, those starting their careers know that there's no chance of ever getting the top job, so they create unrealistic expectations in order to satisfy their own ego.

Makes sense.