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Poland`s aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 5



Novichok
16 Apr 2023  #2731

Why? A peaceful Russia and trade partner would have been in everybody's interest.

Tacitus, I am speechless...That was the smartest thing I read today.

As a true friend of Germany, I hope to see you free of NATO and the US bases.

Russia is not your enemy. Those days are over. The claims that Putin's dreams are to occupy Europe are insane and don't deserve a moment of our attention.

By being connected to the US and its insatiable appetite for wars, you are running risks without benefits.
Don't do that...

PolAmKrakow
16 Apr 2023  #2732

The claims that Putin's dreams are to occupy Europe

I dont think anyone has said he wants to occupy Europe. But he does want the return to a USSR like landscape. If not in total control, then within the Russian "sphere of influence". The Balkans, Czech, Slovakia, Hundary, Belarus, Poland are all targets in little Vlads mind. He would never live to see it, but he could statt the ball rolling with Ukraine.

Novichok
16 Apr 2023  #2733

A reader's comment worth posting here:

Artyomovsk will soon become a Russian city again. Ukraine is not a country anymore, just a battlefield and cemetery for lost people and prospects. All because a little green dwarf did not want to talk out a problem with Russia. His pride and vanity has already cost around 320,000 dead Uki soldiers, but the final price will be much more.

mafketis
16 Apr 2023  #2734

ussia is not your enemy. Those days are over

Yes, the days of russia not being an enemy ended definitively on Feb 24, 2022 when putain decided to invade a peaceful neighbor (technically he just ramped up ongoing military aggression...

There's no coming back for russia to Europe after this without an end to hostilities, retreat from occupied areas (including Crimea) and hefty reparations.

russia made its choice, no use trying to drum up sympathy for it.

cms neuf
16 Apr 2023  #2735

Why do you keep posting dumb comments from other losers at the troll farm ? Is it a cost saving measure ? Next thing you know the troll farm toilets will be cold water only and ripped up copies of the 5 year plan as bog roll.

Nobody west of Minsk ever uses the word Artyemovsk- they would have no idea you are talking about Bakhmut.

When is it going to fall BTW ? No essays, just a predicted date

Korvinus
16 Apr 2023  #2736

Russia in general is "The Great Integrator".

We have already tried the Russian brand of 'integration', never again, would not recommend.

Tacitus
16 Apr 2023  #2737

Russia is not your enemy. Those days are over.

That was what many hoped and some thought until February 2022... . We hoped that the time of countries changing borders through force were over in Europe. Putin's invasion proved all those assumptions wrong.

Russian propagandists have incited hatred against Ukraine for many years. Many did not take them seriously.

Learning from that we should be concerned when the Russian most prominent propagandist talks Solovyov about reestablishing the GDR.

mafketis
16 Apr 2023  #2738

most prominent propagandist talks Solovyov about reestablishing the GDR

or complaining that they didn't nuke London during the Queen's funeral....

russian propaganda is so insane that many outsiders can't believe they take it seriously.... but they do...

GefreiterKania
16 Apr 2023  #2739

320,000 dead Uki soldiers

Reznikov claims that the number of Ukrainian soldiers' deaths in this entire war is lower than the number of the earthquake victims in Turkey (about 50 thousand). He said it in an interview with "La Razon".

Bobko
16 Apr 2023  #2740

Reznikov claims

Did you not read that the current regime in Ukraine has its roots as a troupe of comedians?

This helps to understand much of what they say.

Novichok
16 Apr 2023  #2741

Did you not read that the current regime in Ukraine has its roots as a troupe of comedians?

Somehow, what they do is not haha funny...unless blowing billions on these clowns is humorous.

retreat from occupied areas (including Crimea)

C, D, and L are Russia now - just as Texas is the US. Forever.
Nuclear powers don't give up their own flesh and blood so stop talking sh*it. It's boring by now.

cms neuf
16 Apr 2023  #2742

Muscovy is not nuclear - everyone knows your nukes are rusty junk
Muscovy is not a power any more
They are not your flesh or blood

But you did have some fast jet fighters and good gymnasts back in the 60s so people should never underestimate Muscovy

Korvinus
16 Apr 2023  #2743

current regime in Ukraine has its roots as a troupe of comedians

Yeaaaaah. KGB bunker dwarf with a history of cooperating with the Petersburg mob seems better.

The West cannot build democracy in a lawless wasteland. We learned that in Afghanistan.

If Russians want to live in a healthy democracy, with rule of law and low corruptiom, they will have to try even harder after the fall of Putin's regime. Noone can do the job for them.

Novichok
16 Apr 2023  #2744

I would really appreciate an explanation of why some PF posters are so adamantly against this war.

Wars stimulate the economy.
This war makes NATO stronger and Russia weaker.
The US is paying the bills so Europe doesn't have to.
Poland benefits from the refugees and feels heroic.
Western Europe is going green at a faster rate.
NATO countries dump old mil junk.

Did I miss any other benefits?

So, what's up with that, guys...For all of the above, you should wish Putin to stay in good health and continue until Russia finally collapses and the gay flag is firmly planted in Kremlin.

cms neuf
16 Apr 2023  #2745

Well one reason is we care about our innocent friends and neighbors in Ukraine

That kind of reasoning is alien to Muscovy - they don't even care about their own Siberian farm boys

Bobko
16 Apr 2023  #2746

everyone knows your nukes are rusty junk

Yes. Our cruise missiles also don't fly. This is why we launched multiples of what NATO did during Desert Storm, Shock & Awe, and Libya combined. Also our planes can't take off. Our tanks won't start. Our shells won't explode. Our SAM operators are drunks.

Did I forget anything?

GefreiterKania
16 Apr 2023  #2747

Did I forget anything?

Your 3-day blitzkrieg started well over a year ago now, and you're not able to take one landlocked sh*thole of a town in 8 months.

Happy to help :)

Bratwurst Boy
16 Apr 2023  #2748

The US is paying the bills so Europe doesn't have to.

Na ja....the upcoming rebuilding of our Bundeswehr will cost BILLIONS! Money we actually don't have, nor haven't planned for...in our envisioned future of peace and cooperation all over Europe!

The US will surely not pay for that, quite the contrary demanding now even more relentlessly that Germany keeps to it's expensive promises (2% anybody)....

cпасибо comrade Putin!

Not to mention all these refugees WE have to support and feed, not the US....somehow your calculation is screwed!

Bobko
16 Apr 2023  #2749

Happy to help :)

Soon enough all will be clear.

In this landlocked sh!thole of a town, an amount of UA soldiers equivalent to half that town's pre-war population has been "utilized".

Tacitus
16 Apr 2023  #2750

cost BILLIONS

From which quite a few will go to the USA.

The new F35 (made in USA) will cost around 9bn.

GefreiterKania
16 Apr 2023  #2751

Meanwhile in Poland...



Novichok
16 Apr 2023  #2752

Na ja....the upcoming rebuilding of our Bundeswehr will cost BILLIONS!

For the defense of Germany, not Ukraine. The US is funding the war in Ukraine.

The US will surely not pay for that, quite the contrary demanding now even more relentlessly that Germany

Give the US the middle finger and keep what you need to defend Germany and fu*ck everybody else. But first try to find your enemy and, hopefully, somewhere close, not 7000 miles away.

No, you don't need NATO. Just the opposite. Your economy is suffering because of NATO - the snake that deprived you of inexpensive and reliable energy from Russia.

Not to mention all these refugees WE have to support and feed, not the US

Your PF buddies said many times that (1) Ukrainian refugees are an asset, and (2) a reason to be proud, so what's the problem?
Sorry, BB, I know you don't deserve my sarcasm but I couldn't resist it. My apologies.

Bratwurst Boy
16 Apr 2023  #2753

For the defense of Germany, not Ukraine.

Does it matter? We have to pay for that.....

Give the US the middle finger

That's also such an un-smart consequence of Putin's invasion....two years back the number of Germans who did just that was much bigger than now! The US has never had more german friends than just now....great job!

Your economy is suffering because of NATO

Imagine Nordstream would had done it's job....cheap endless supply of energy for the german industry and consumers....not that actual crisis! Thanks again!!!

The new F35 (made in USA) will cost around 9bn.

....some happy arms producer.....

Please cut down on your quotes

Bratwurst Boy
16 Apr 2023  #2754

Sorry, BB, I know you don't deserve my sarcasm but I couldn't resist it.

When I re-read my arguments I can't help it....that war is so wrong on so many accounts....if not dementia, could it be that Putin works for the CIA or something????

The lone winner here is in the end the US and NATO and it's arms supplier, sorry!

PS: Okay....maybe China too....they probably get a new vasall under their thumb.....

Novichok
16 Apr 2023  #2755

So fu*cking what! How does that fact negates what I just said?
One more time...There is a Russia desk in DC. There is no Poland desk.

Korvinus
16 Apr 2023  #2756

The mega milestone was the end of communism in the USSR and the USSR itself.

You seem to think USA and Soviet Union were equal partners in the end of 80s/start of 90s. They were not. US was at the peak of its power, both hard and soft. Soviet Union was a collapsing giant, bankrupt and hated not only by its official 'allies' from the Warsaw Pact, but also by significant percentage of its own population.

But I remember the poverty of the time, the lack of most basic necessities. And I also remember hope that inspired people when the regime finally collapsed and for the first time in decades Poles were once again in control of their own future.

Sure, the first years were difficult, we had to transform our whole economy and get rid of the rampant socialist wastefulness. And yet the program of socio-economic reforms had a firm support of the majority of population. Every government of Poland (including cabinets formed by post-communist politicians which lead the country in years 1993-97 and 2001-2005) continued with the transformation. Nobody wanted a return to the bad old days.

Of course, we also celebrated liberation from under Soviet control. When the last Russian troops left in 1993 we were finally free to pursue our own goals, which were quite evident to everyone: Poles always felt as members of the West, not the East, so applying for NATO and EU membership was a no-brainer. We knew Russian weakness is only temporary and were willing to secure our position in the structures of Euro-Atlantic partnership before it ends. And despite all the difficulties, we succeeded in this feat.

It's a pity our neighbours from Belarus and Ukraine could not take advantage of the same window of opportunity. If they did,we would not be having the conversation we have today.

mafketis
16 Apr 2023  #2757

Soviet Union was a collapsing giant, bankrupt and hated ... also by significant percentage of its ... population

Pretty much by all who weren't russian (or ethnic russian in the case of settlers meant to displace the locals in the Baltics).

I've read a few times that 1986 was the turning point, when a majority began to realize that the Soviet propaganda about the USSR having better living standards than the west collapsed.... I'm assuming that might be related to the advent of VCRs

Novichok
16 Apr 2023  #2758

that the Soviet propaganda about the USSR having better living standards than the west

The Soviet propaganda worked well only with the leftist Western morons whose kids now are spreading communism here. We knew it was crap and always wanted to get the hell out.

cms neuf
16 Apr 2023  #2759

I don't think it was VCRs - I think in 1986 word got round in Muscovy that in the west there were bath plugs, leather shoes and corn flakes. Those are still luxuries in Muscovy even today

mafketis
16 Apr 2023  #2760

Sexual abuse in the russian army? I would say "Say it isn't so!" but... of course it's so....

twitter.com/ChrisO_wiki/status/1647674534475038721

I guess the usual suspects will be glad that it's at least heterosexual abuse and not the usual gay prostitution that russian recruits are forced into....


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