Poland under pressure of EU to accept more asylum seeking refugees

So Poland has to flip the tab for these dumb ideas of prompting up wars by supporting rebellions in these Arab countries that latter gave these people a ruse to flood into Europe? Poland had very little to do with this, but they still take Christian refugees. I'd say Poland is doing more then enough. Yes, I realize that the migrants tear down fences and attack border guards... I believe its going to be double fenced, could be modified if needed, maybe even make it electric fence so they know not to touch. If they bypass the route of eastern Europe then its not our problem.


Poland is involved, it acts with the Visegrad group, with the dissatisfaction of the EU of handling this situation.

@Szalawa: Poland is involved in mess too: wars in Irak, in Afghanistan, CIA's prisons on Polish territory so Poland (in order to make money: how low!) can not pretend it is none of its business. Poland has never been neutral and is one of the boys.

There were lots of other options on the table, it's not like "come one come all" was the only possible reaction. It was a reaction that Merkel thought could improve her image and what happens to her countrymen is something she has in her dvpa as the Polish say.

Asylum was never meant for large groups of people and current asylum laws date before the era of open borders and cheap travel and large scale for-profit human smuggling networks.

The EU could have agreed to Greece repatriating refugees back in Turkey (which would have been an extremely tense, but probably short lived process). Set up some processing centers in Turkey and jordan and watch them run in the opposite direction.

I do hame some sympathy for Syrians who find their country the vehicle of a proxy war (or several proxy wars) between the Saudis and Iran and Russia and Turkey (probably missing some). But I have more sympathy for Europeans who've worked long and hard to buld a peaceful prosperous continent because the current peace and prosperity is also fragile and cannot stand too many Middle Eastern migrants (large scale Middle Eastern/Muslim migration to Europe has been an unmitigated disaster everwhere it's been tried and there's no reason to assume this time would be any different).

Define flooding. For me flooding means this:


Here:
Until 2015, the rise in Mediterranean Sea arrivals was seen primarily in Italy. Over the course of 2014, it received over three quarters of all arrivals by sea (170,000). During all of last year, 34,442 people arrived in Greece, less than one fifth of the total number of arrivals.

In 2015, that picture changed. During the first six months of 2015, 70,354 people arrived in Italy, while 69,000 arrived on the Greek islands - more than the number for whole of 2014.

iom.int/news/migrant-boat-arrivals-europe-top-150000-2015

The problem is that majority of people coming to Greece arrive from Turkey hence their are not refugees. Yet, at the beginning of 2014 Amnesty International called upon the EU to sanction Greece " for its failure to eradicate the routine and widespread practice of pushing back refugees and migrants arriving at its borders in search of protection, safety, and better futures in Europe [...]There are cases where they have been [...] held at gunpoint before being pushed back across the border to Turkey."

Some back story for year 2014 and Italy.
Italy's left-wing government became the first European Union country to decriminalise illegal immigration and deploy its navy at huge expense to save 'illegal' migrants crossing the narrow Sicilian channel in open boats from North Africa (Libya mainly) in order to bring them to Italy and thus the European Union - where most remain.

Spain especially, Greece too, and even the Maltese, use force to keep out migrantshttp://www.spectator.co.uk/2014/09/italys-decriminalising-of-illegal-immigration-has-acted-as-a-green-light-to-boat-people/
Not for long.
The International Organization for Migration (IOM) estimates that more than 1,011,700 migrants arrived by sea in 2015, and almost 34,900 by land.

This compares with 280,000 arrivals by land and sea for the whole of 2014
Merkel triggered in August 2015,majority of illegals arrived after that date. Coincidence?


You mistaken me. I'm not comparing present day Germany with the DR or whatnot. I'm assessing and judging German ability to handle power, leadership and responsibility and find them very poorly indeed.

There are ill suited for that role.

@Ironside: do you have (reliable) sources re Luxembourg's laundering money paid to smugglers? This could be most interesting. Now nothing would suprise me re the matter. I often read that all this mess is a plot against Europe and it may very well be. And as to Junker, at least, in Western Europe, we all know his background and this guy should sit in jail rather than to dictate his "whims" to 500 million people who have not elected him.

@Johnny: xenophobia/racism is when systematically hating people based upon their nationalites/races and when last summer, you guys, sytematically hated migrants because they happen to be Arabs and Muslims, yes, it was xenophobia. I am now against migrants not because of where they come from (should they be from Liechtenstein or Zimbabwe, I would react the same way) but because of their misdeeds (WHO could tolerate terrorism, sexual agressions, various incivilities (who can consider "normal" to relieve oneself in a swimming pool? In their countries, they do not so obviously it is pure agression to European populations) and also I am now against migrants because it is not any longer a matter of a few thousands (per country) as it was last summer but a matter of millions and should we say "amen", EU will end up with double population and needless to say, Europe cannot. Contrary to you guys, I don't base my comments and belief upon origin and religion (I have no problems with other nationalities, other races, colors, religions or whatsoever provided that they behave themselves and they are no threat) but on the very situation (dangerous mess and too many of them). In PF, as written yesterday, some (incl. roz) are still in favor of taking migrants in, so let them take care of them with their personal money and their efforts + time! ;)

Well, in post #2094 you said "once again they proved to be unable to handle power". Emphasis on "once again", which means that you are comparing present day Germany to something in the past. What is it then if not the Third Reich? Just trying to understand.


So it's Greece, Italy and Turkey that are mostly to blame?


In hindsight it looks as if Merkel and her buddies (Hollande, Cameron and Junker) had an agenda, although I cannot fathom why they would want to destroy Europe.


Absolutely.

That has little to do with the current refugee crisis as most of these people are not coming from Iraq and Afghanistan, although there still might be some. Poland does not run the CIA and can not be held accountable for that. Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were just minor support, its not like Poland waved the green light. No reason to blackmail Poland to accept more refugees for that.

@Szalawa: of course it has "something" to do since Poland has contributed in destabilizing area. And re CIA's prisons in Poland, for sure Poland does not run CIA but accepting to torture foreigners for a few dollars like Poland did is not very glorious and when Strabourg Court of Justice condemned Poland, very few Polish politicians dared mentioning if as I suppose (and I hope) most Poles were ashamed of it. Yes, when Poland joins other to destroy countries, when Poland tortures on top of that on Polish territory, Poland is in the mess too. Poland cannot have its cake and eat it too...

OH YEAH, Because before Iraq War the Middle East was extremelly stable, right?

Don't talk about things that you HAVE NO IDEA from your luxury flat in France! You never had stepped in middle east and know nothing about here!

The region is already unstable for the last 1400 years!!!! Blame USA, Putin or whatever (which in fact didn't helped, but also didn't caused) just shows how brainwashed by your french socialist media you are.


Those countries in this part of the world (Yeah, differently than you, french upper middle class, i LIVE in Middle east) were destroyed and messed LONG AGO.

When USA was habitated by Navajos and Poland was still a Commonwealth with Lithuania.

Donald Tusk tells economic migrants not to come to Europe, But offers real refugees help.

liveleak.com/view?i=ead_1457003762

Just a note to all that wish to welcome undocumented and non vetted migrants into Europe , please take note of the below.

The nanny accused of beheading a four-year-old girl and waving her severed head outside a Moscow Metro station said it was revenge for "Putin's airstrikes in Syria" while it has emerged the woman was a mental hospital patient in her native Uzbekistan. source the ruskie press.

What checks and vetting was carried out on the hundreds of thousands of Poles who moved to the UK alone during and just after WWII? From memory it turned out that a few of them were genocidal scum, does that mean the hundreds of thousands who were not should have been kept out?

No matter how loud scum is screaming, it's pretty much clear to all sane people that the whole "refugees" madness will end up with most of 3rd worlders being deported where they came from. Sooner or later we will also learn about scum that took money from oil arabs to bring that madness upon us. Scum illegally crossing the borders should be shot.

I am not sure that they will "listen" to Tusk ;). "lol"

Not the same area where most these so called refugees are coming from. Why should one be ashamed of something one did not do? and why must this so called imaginary guilt be used as an excuse to offload some freeloaders onto Poland? these people have set their minds to go to countries with good benefits, they don't want to go to Poland and Poland does not want them. What makes you say this is a good recipe for your so called cake?

They were trying to lead. An IDEA that all GERMANS in 50 odd states are a one nation lead to war and supremacy of Prussia over all those states. A badly handled leadership.

Third Reich an ideal of German supremacy and the world domination - badly handled.
A benevolent liberal German state and claimed leadership in the EU - badly handled.
Common denomination for examples - Germany becoming a very powerful nation handles it in a spectacularly bad way. At the tangent Germany with Power lies a point that messes it all up.


Stupid people in places of power and some behind the curtain games are to blame.


Hard to believe that someone can be that dumb. My guess is as good as your guess.

@Szalawa: it is not only in Poland but everywhere else as all borders (even in Germany) are getting closed. I suppose that Merkel and co had in mind to take in some refugees (I have nothing against that) but as it has turned to, most of people coming are not refugees and there are millions and millions of them and it'll never be finished, no country wants them.

As to guilt, sorry but to let foreigners be tortured in one's country just for the sake of money is very low. For years, Polish authorities tried to deny these CIA prisons in Poland and when it was proved and finally acknoledged by Poland and when Poland was condemned by Strasbourg Court of Justice, most Polish politicians kept a very low profile.

And that is EXAACTLY what we tried to tell you nine months ago at the start of this mess but you wouldn't listen.
Go back and look at the posts where we repeatedly told YOU that these people were not war refugees, that these people were all men of fighting age, that these people were coming from Africa, that there were terrorists mixed in with them, that it was going to destroy Europe.

Now that all of this is coming true I hope you can see that it will never be able to be undone.
The EU's culture's and economy have been destroyed by these undesirables.
And you liberals here on the PF cry that the U.S.A. should take their fair share and not start deporting them. Helloooooo !
Poland is the last EU country that has not destroyed it's White ethnic Christian culture by refusing to bow to Merkel and the boys.

Stay strong Poland and screw the Liberals Political Correctness.

So what now?


Just by the fact that this is a CIA site you can't really expect everyone to know whats going on, most probable case is that most people did not know. Of course there might be a few individuals that knew about it but that does not make everyone accountable for that. We can speak more about this but this is the wrong thread.

You mean the 'polishforums'?

lol, is it? ;) do we have an insider here

Yes, somebody is intentionally creating this crisis. Pretty sure you can figure it out once you realize who's controlling the US media, the US banks and the US government. It's a riddle!

The ewwws are the biggest manipulators and through manipulation they are able to keep shifting the blame from one side to the other for the said crisis and nobody will openly point finger at them - the real culprits - so long as the media, banks and governments are in their grabby hands.

It looks like Greece will end up becoming one big camp, they will probably get debt relief for allowing this. Maybe that was the plan all along. Germany didn't want to look as though it was allowing the Greeks to back out of paying off their loans but knew that for them to not end up leaving something drastic was necessary so they invited all the muslims they could, made a mess and are now going to allow them to be walled off in Greece. Germany will continue to "search" for other solutions but will secretly be happy to pay Greece to keep them there and save the Euro.

If they are kept in several camps without luxury, the new ones will stop coming and many of those already in, will be going back to Turkey... people that really need help are trapped in the war zone or went to Lebanon where they are struggling to survive, those in Greece had to come from Turkey, a safe mid-income country.


Hard to say what was the plan but there surely was some plan, such things don't just happen.

That's exactly what's happening in Germany now. It seems that while the Federal government had one idea, the Lander had a different idea - and so they were made as uncomfortable as possible. The problem seems to be one of nativity - many of those coming are under the impression that Germany was handing out nice apartments and huge amounts of welfare, which simply isn't and wasn't true.


I can't work it out. Opening the door to genuine refugees is one thing, but who on earth advised Merkel that it was a sound idea to let in just anyone? Even left-leaning Germans I know are utterly bewildered about the whole thing, not least because the vast majority of them can't see how North African Arabs (that already screwed up their own countries) will ever integrate into German society.

The only thing I can think of is that Merkel was under pressure from business to find a way to bring cheap labour into Germany through some law allowing employers to pay less than minimum wage to non-EU citizens or something. I don't buy any sinister conspiracy theories simply because it was obvious that the V4+others would go beserk.

I could come up with at least 20 "crazy" theories why that happened and the truth is likely crazier than any of them.

Then why invite a bunch of people with a track record of rejecting employment? The last I knew (last fall) over 70% of those who qualified for apprenticeships (a small minority within the overall group) quit very quickly saying they thought the positions offered were beneath them. If you want to undercut local labor through immigration it helps to have people who will actually work.

My current theory is that it was part of Merkel's ongoing jihad against Greece. At various points in the negotiations on debt reduction (agreed by most serious analysts to be necessary) the Greek side was threatening to send the migrants directly to Germany - Germany called their bluff and took that off the negotiating table.

I also think that wrecking the welfare state and reducing the levels of female employment were secondary goals or extra benefits....

A 3 year study of 4000 free loaders, sorry, refugees in Sweden by 2 professors, at the end of the study, of the ones they could trace, 93% were unemployed. Its been mentioned on a number of news channels of an increase in the number of elderly women and unaccompanied children arriving, just what can they contribute, just like sponges sucking Europe dry.

So after about 1 year all of sudden NATO ships are going to be a barrier between Turkey and Greece, a bit like closing the gate after the horse has bolted.

As I've said before regarding this quota idea, It doesn't matter where you put these people, at the end of the day they will decide where they want to be, so you send Mr and Mrs from Somalia with their 6 kids to Estonia, give it no more than a week and woosh, gone, how do you keep them there.

When ever a ''refugee' is interviewed they always give the same answer, ''I want to go to Germany, UK, Austria'' nobody ever ask why.

That's the mysterious part to me as well. I understand opening the door to Ukrainians or Russians, but opening the door to Arabs who completely screwed up their own countries... I don't get it. I even understand letting in Syrians and Iraqis fleeing - but I cannot understand the idea of letting in single Arab men - who are notorious for their condescending, arrogant, lazy attitude as a whole.


The latter, I'm not sure about. But it certainly does a lot to wreck the possibilities of the SPD enacting further social welfare.


Probably, you're not far off the truth.

I don't think anyone sane will forgive Germany for wrecking not only Schengen but also giving a lot of power to those that want to see the end of the EU. I still don't understand why it wasn't proposed to throw Germany out of Schengen.