Ukraine Crisis... Poland... and the way i see it

maybe..
Iraqi had weapon of mass destruction

In this case Barney, it was. All one needed to do in order to vote was to go to a polling station with your ID: there was no need to be on the electoral roll, you could register to vote right there and then. But why let facts get in your way?


The Kremlin line is that the referendum was fair and that the new government in Ukraine are a bunch of neo-Nazis: how does that differ from your stance?

Iraqi - A native or inhabitant of Iraq - particularly, which one do you mean - who was that bastard?

ask blair and bush and western media...they should know why they killed million ppl
my point was ppl shouldn't believe what USA politician and western media says.now they claim Crimea votes were rigged.i have no reason to believe their claims,they have no credibility

they refused to sent observers and those who went there had no objection regarding this referendum being fair

Anybody who has even a primary school understanding of maths and history can see that the referendum was rigged.
If western media told you that if you wrapped yourself in heavy chains and then jumped into the middle of a deep lake you wouldn't drown, would you do it just to demonstrate that the western media have no credibility? I can make some calls to have that story run somewhere.

am talking about credibility regarding important geopolitical worlds events.
lots of media news and way they present them are driven by their political motives and political loyalties not to mention money ,political corectness and so on so..i don't believe in objectiveness of media anymore

As opposed to Russian media, which is currently reporting that


Source: pravda.ru/news/world/formerussr/ukraine/20-03-2014/1200946-poland-0/

i dont believe them neither..got to get lot of sources and read between the lines sometimes to find the truth

this is rubbish...there would be uprising if any part of western Ukraine is handed to Poland.Ukrainians would run amok.

That doesn't mean that the electorate is the same as the adult population it means the exact opposite, it also means that those who boycotted the referendum gave a landslide to the other side, that is basic maths.

Do you actually know what the word 'turnout' means Barney? It seems you don't.

Yes Harry that's why I corrected you when I said


I also pointed out that the electorate is not the same as the adult population, you are confusing the electorate with the population.

Unfortunately for you, Barney, it seems that the electorate in Crimea is larger than the adult population. Enjoy reading this: kyivpost.com/opinion/op-ed/euan-macdonald-number-of-crimean-votesr-appears-to-be-greatly-inflated-by-pro-russian-counters-340368.html

Why is that unfortunate for me? I simply pointed out that the maths you were using were wrong.

That article does point out that there are no hard figures for the census or electoral roll which is what I have been saying.

You're not telling the truth Barney: the article rep orts that there are 1,844,589 on the official electoral roll.

The figure you have just quoted is being disputed by the article you posted for that very reason, it states


From the article


Which is what I said above.

So are you accepting the Russian figures or not? You are not being clear.

I'm saying that the referendum has clearly been rigged.

Yes, that bit is clear what isn't clear is the evidence that it has been clearly rigged. You may feel it's rigged but you have no evidence to support that view. I simply pointed out the error in your maths....that's all.

For me it's not important as the crimea can't just declare UDI.

Yes, no evidence at all it was rigged, other than the official result and turnout.

And Crimea hasn't made a UDI.

But Harry we have been through this you have no evidence, if you had you would post the evidence.

Crimea did declare UDI.

what means this comment of yours. Does it mean that most of the Poles thinks opposite to me or it means that most of the Poles even don`t want to know truth, because after all, what would they with the truth?

Well the western press sure seems satisfied that it was an overwhelmingly pro Russian vote.They mention the fact that the US and the EU doesn't recognize it,as an afterthought now.

I did not read all 10 pages of everyone's opinions, but I have a feeling that this concern for Ukraine is largely because of the dislike of Putin and Russia. Ukraine has not done a very good job of governing itself, always cries poverty while sitting on excellent farming land, and, according to my family, Ukrainians have a penchant for slicing people's throats.

"Brandishing fabricated accounts of Ukrainian fascists threatening Crimea, he has defied the principle that intervention abroad should be a last resort in the face of genuine suffering. He cites NATO's bombing of Kosovo in 1999 as a precedent, but that came after terrible violence and exhaustive efforts at the UN-which Russia blocked. Even then Kosovo was not, like Crimea, immediately annexed, but seceded nine years later.

Mr Putin's new order, in short, is built on revanchism, a reckless disdain for the truth and the twisting of the law to mean whatever suits those in power. That makes it no order at all.

Sadly, too few people understand this. Plenty of countries resent American primacy and Western moralising. But they would find Mr Putin's new order far worse."

Ukraine has always wanted to be free of Russia. I don't think it's personal.

There are a lot of intellectuals like you who have "feelings". Feelings, my dear, are good for bedroom and movies. When you talk about politics, you better use sober thinking, if you are interested to be read seriously. If you consider the invasion by a foreign country as something normal and dislike of Putin by the whole world as something drawn from a thin air, then I'd recommend you to watch soap operas, where you can express your "feelings" to the fullest.

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Nathan, my dear man, obviously you are very emotional about your anti russian stance, good for you, but by ridiculing other people's opinions you are handicapping yourself. I'm not the only one that thinks Poland should shield itself from the crisis in the east. Russia's motives, as well as US, are purely economic and strategic, and everyone has their own reasons for picking sides. Take a chill pill, and don't be insulting.

I didn't ridicule your opinion, rather your so-called feelings on political issues, which I consider inappropriate and immature.


You insulted me and my nation by quoting your chauvinistic family's statement.

on an odd chance that you actually believe what you wrote, I'll try to explain. "I have a feeling" is usually a polite lead-in to expressing an opinion. If in doubt, if it's not followed by an adjective such as "sad" or "happy", you may assume it is an opinion.


as far as the "chauvinistic family's statement", it's anything but. It is a result of my family's many first hand experiences, not the least of it barely escaping with their lives from what was then their home in Ukraine.

And again, try to calm yourself down, so you won't imagine others watching soap operas, or whatever visions you suffer from.

Arguably, "Ukrainians" have already run amok. There are now fewer "Ukrainians" than there were just a month ago, as the residents of Crimea are now more likely considered Russians. The fact is that Western Ukraine, especially the former Galician provinces, are historically Polish, and still have a Polish minority which Poland could legitimately claim to be protecting if the Russians invade Ukraine. Considering that residents in Polish territory would be de facto members of the EU, it is hard to understand why people would be alarmed, unless of course they prefer to be poor farmers.

I found this article fairly humorous, but it does put some things in perspective. For example, wouldn't Bielorussians be better off with Putin?