Ukraine Crisis... Poland... and the way i see it

The problem with the EU project is that the marvellous concept of a union of people from the Burren to the Urals has been derailed by the extreme right wing economics of the EU and the EU acting as the political wing of NATO.

The asset stripping and austerity that is about to be imposed on Ukraine was totally unnecessary, profitable mines in the Lviv region are being closed, the miners held a rally in Kiev and were drafted for the war in the east. No one stood for election on an austerity ticket yet here it comes.

:) :) . you must be pretty ignorant to call the EU a "project". Particularly giving the fact that you are posting on a Polish forum.

That doesn't make any sense; It's common to refer to the EU as a project simply because it is a project for European integration.

My dear Barney, if it does not make sense to you that it is ok. If you will ever have the opportunity to travel to Poland you may have the opportunity to visit a project funded by the EU. Projects don't normally get funded by other "projects".

Of course, you will continue to argue from your sofa again until everyone is tired of your repetition.

That is just babble for the sake of babble.

Edit

Seriously what was the point of your comments? You took exception to something I said so typed meaningless nonsense, is that how you communicate in general?

Barney, you will find that i have given plenty of points to discuss upon. Every single one was ignored by you and your Kremlin friends, You have no better argument than "democratic norms" or "due process was not followed".

You sit on your warm sofa and expect Ukraine to follow democratic standards while you are missing the point that Ukraine is at war. Shall we go back to the argument of Yanukovich and how he has dismantled democracy in Ukraine? Shall we go back to how Ukraine is now at war with parts of its territory annexed already? Or do you get the point that your democratic values that you want to defend so much, while you stuff your face with pizza and coke, do not apply just now? Do you get it or do you want to continue to make an arse out of yourself?

He's young Barney, just ignore him like the rest of us have.
That's why I purposely directed my question to Crow but as usual within ten minutes
here comes my stalker with sarcastic remarks.
He still is pooping yellow Barney, just a youngster that is a wanna be.

Apparently you are free to abuse me all you want, the simple fact is you took exception to me describing the EU as a project which it clearly is. It's a phrase used by all the major news outlets and is commonly used in English so if you have some reason to object to the EU project being so described let's hear it.

With regard to democratic norms and the rule of law, that is how normal countries conduct themselves. Reject those democratic norms all you want (as you have) but don't consider your opinions to be anything other than extremly undemocratic.

It's clear that you don't have any form of argument to present so throw abuse I just wonder why you bother replying if you have nothing to say?

Continue to throw abuse, call me an arse, fantasise about what I eat and all the rest of your rant but under no circumstance should you attempt to form a cogent argument.

Of course, johnny......what have you contributed to this thread apart from "it has all been planned long before"?

When I asked you why the orange revolution was not used, seeing that it was all planned for so long, you did not have an answer.

Johnny........keep trying :) .......

He just likes to argue Barney

I am not abusing you Barney. It is the last thing on my mind. I am just wondering how you get to your mindset about democracy in a war ridden country. You must be pretty "well looked after", if not to call you deluded, to think that Ukraine has no other priorities than the investigations you keep calling for.


with facts, yes!


:) ok


Ignore me so you can discuss plastic timing chains like you have claimed in the other thread or the fact that you don't have access to the internet yet you post here........

You see Johnny.......i keep repeating this....... you still have not responded to my points of discussion in this thread. All we got from you was "it was all planned long ago"..............

Two links to British news sources using the common phrase European project. What future for the European project?

Never again? The loss of trust in the European project holds great dangers.

Now Jolly perhaps you could explain why the BBC and the Guardian are pretty ignorant or do you just like posting meaningless abuse?

Edit
Calling me an arse speculating about what I eat and so on has nothing to do with the topic and is indeed abuse. If you can't post without abusing or explaining I would prefer if you didn't respond to me.

Not that i did not read these articles before but......


BBC: Publish date - 25 September 2012
The Guardian: Publish date - 27 January 2014

.......try again you troll

You think that showing that the phrase "European project" is commonly used in English makes me a troll, are you serious? What relevance has their dates of publication?

What is your objection to the phrase? You told me I was ignorant but you won't say why, that is abuse.

Ok Barney, i will leave you to it. Please hug your tovarish Johnny, who like you has never and will never set foot into Ukraine or possibly even Europe for that matter.

I hope your Pizza and Coke will suit you to your taste while you advise other countries how they have to be democratic in war time :)

Jolly
"European project" remember, using that phrase makes me, the BBC and the Guardian ignorant. Using that phrase makes me a troll it seems, because of the date of publication. Do you have any explanation for your abuse?

Like the other guy, the next time you try to be a smartarse have a wee think.

Barney, I will bear that in mind next time you are trying to tell a country at war that it should stick to democratic norms. :)

There was no war when the president was removed so that rather pathetic excuse doesn't apply.
Still no explanation why the BBC etc are ignorant for using a common phrase or why you abused me for using that phrase.

Yes Jolly, and that is what baffles me is why you keep embarrassing yourself like when I had you google plastic timing chains and there they were. Of course you have never been wrong so you still deny that they are made out of a plastic composite.

We won the war too.
Just ignore him Barney as it is obvious that there are some mental issue going on with him.

Yes, and there was no democracy because the president dismantled the trust given by the people of Ukraine piece by piece. Pathetic excuse? Educate yourself on the first decree under Yanukovich and what change in power it brought to the president. Can you discuss it in detail? Are you aware of the first decree that Yanukovich signed after he gained power? :)


Ah Johnny, I have told you. Accessible for everyone. If you want to keep trolling, keep doing so. It is ok for me :)

"When the president was removed"
When was that? I seem to remember the president abandoning his duties and his post and then the democratically elected legislature appointed a president who would do the job. But then I also remember a poster here claiming that the man appointed acting president had stood in the last presidential election and got one percent of the vote. I remember things that happened; Barney tells us about things that didn't happen, or perhaps you can explain why you told us that blatant lie about the then acting president, Barney?

The one who poisoned his opponent, rigged the election and fled with a fortune. "Democratic norms", eh?

You claimed that Ukraine didn't have to adhere to democratic norms because there was a war, when the president was removed democratic procedure was not followed. There was no war so your excuse doesn't apply, I described the excuse as pathetic because it's used by every authoritarian regime to avoid democratic norms. The civil war doesn't prevent any democratic norms being followed and doesn't explain why the little investigation that has been conducted is being sabotaged by the regime.

It is unimportant what yanukovich did or didn't do there was a new regime. This regime started by ignoring the constitution and continued by ignoring democratic norms.

Back to the EU project why do you describe the bbc, the Guardian and me as ignorant for using that phrase? Why insult me for using that phrase, why post abuse?

Barney, is there no chance of you explaining why you claim that the man appointed acting president had stood in the last presidential election and got one percent of the vote?

Jon
We are talking about the new regime that is starting to implement Thatcherite policies that no one voted for.

The last president was as corrupt as all Ukrainian presidents. The hypocritical thing is that he is being criticised for ignoring democratic norms and the current regime is being excused from adhering to these norms.

There is nothing disingenuous about expecting those claiming to be democrats to adhere to democratic norms with or without inverted commas.

We, Barney, are talking about a democratically elected government in a country led by a democratically elected president. You keep talking about a regime, but you're noted for talking about things that don't exist, such as neo-Nazis in charge of Ukrainian government ministries and a man appointed acting president who had stood in the last presidential election and got one percent of the vote, etc, etc, etc.

I have never claimed such a thing. Not once in any of my posts in this thread. Try again


Wrong! It is important what he did. Why? Because if the elected president starts to dismantle democracy, if he gives himself more and more power basically taking over the state completely, then he has no legitimacy as a "democratic elected president" anymore. The draconian laws were the last straw for the Ukrainian people. By signing these laws he has shown that he is not interested in democracy and that he is on his way to form a second Belarus. Is this so difficult for you to understand?

Well jolly you said there was nothing to investigate, that you were presenting facts. It turns out your facts were incorrect, there was rioting before the 30th November despite you claiming otherwise, questions have been asked about the shootings by investigative journalists from western MSM. There is no constutional basis for removing the President. You excused the new regime by citing the war however your chronology is again wrong, there was no war when these events took place.

Public and transparent Investigations are normal in a democracy and it's in the new regime's interests to have their version of events shown to be correct. The new regime has been sabotaging the rather weak investigation they established and it has to be asked why. You don't think an enquiry is necessary because you said know the facts.

The corruption of the previous president is irrelevant (though should form part of the investigation) because he is no longer in power. The power to order an enquiry lies with the new regime not the old one.

The imposition of draconian economic policies that no one voted for will not be part of the enquiry that will not happen.

Its far from love. Slavs giving very little chances to EU, to that Germanic project in which even Anglos don`t see themselves but seek to join in some USA-British conglomerate.

Slavs would stay in EU to the first opportunity to escape in acceptable alternative

"There is no constutional basis for removing the President."
Lucky for all then that he abandoned his duties, his post and his capital (obviously only his capital city, he made sure to get the money he'd stolen out).

Should we assume that you aren't going to explain your fantasy about him being replaced by a man who had stood in the last presidential election and got one percent of the vote? Is that just yet another of the lies you get caught telling here and then try to pretend never happened?