Ukraine Crisis... Poland... and the way i see it

I doubt the Ukrainian government would see 'producing' anything for you to be a priority. They have other things on their plate right now, like terrorist acts in the east of their country and massed Russian troops on the border.

Now how about addressing even a few of the long list of lies you've told here?

Jon there is no evidence to show that the president was removed lawfully his removal was unconstitutional that is a coup. I'm sure the new regime does have other things to do like trying to discriminate against their fellow citizens and trying to reverse the Russian annexation of Crimea and plunging the country into austerity all without a mandate. At the very least the rush to the IMF should be put on hold until the people have been given a chance to vote.

The plain truth is that the undemocratic actions of the nazi backed Junta have led directly to this situation.

Rather than just trotting out the same tired and discredited lie time and time and time again, why don't you try to address some of the other lies that you have treated us to? For example:

you said that the Ukrainian Interior Minister, Arsen Avakov, founded the Ukrainian Nazi Party;
you said that the current acting president of Ukraine stood in the 2010 presidential elections and got 1% of the vote;
you said that special police units were sent to Odessa in response to the deaths there before the deaths happened;
you said that the secretary of an advisory state body to the president of Ukraine is able to control the composition of the National Guard of Ukraine;

you said that the secretary of an advisory state body to the president of Ukraine is in direct control of the security services, which are actually under the control of the Interior Minister; and

you said that Neo-nazis are in control of the Armed Forces, National Security, Economy, Justice and Education ministries.

Are you ever going to address those lies? Or will you simply add to this list by telling more lies?

How, Barney, can we believe your opinion when you've been caught out telling such a long list of lies?

Maybe there are good explanations for his 'comments'. Maybe he is telling the truth and everybody else is lying. Could it be that Barney is telling the truth about the current acting president of Ukraine standing in the 2010 presidential elections and getting 1% of the vote but there has since then been a global conspiracy to hide that fact? Could it be that the Ukrainian Interior Minister, Arsen Avakov, did found the Ukrainian Nazi Party and since then that fact has been scrubbed from history? Could it have been that special police units were sent to Odessa in response to the deaths there before the deaths happened? Could be, could be, could well be!

Er, on second thoughts, no, none of those things could have happened: Barney is simply lying about them.

Jon I don't care if you believe what I say or not, no one is forcing you to answer.

I'm interested in this subject and I have yet to see any evidence anywhere that the president was removed constitutionally that makes his removal a coup unless you would like to redefine the word it remains a coup. The same goes for the installation of the Junta it was as democratic a process as the farce in Crimea or the more recent example in the east.

I don't believe what you say. The long list of proven lies that you've trotted out in this thread and the number of times you've been caught out destroy any credibility you might have on the issue.

Jon As I said I don't really care, and it appears that you don't much care for the topic.

I questioned the whataboutery and wondered if there was a specific reason for it, it appears there isn't. Instead of saying that there was no reason for your contradictory stance you asked about my personal life and chatted as though this thread were a text service. That's fine but that is what Chat and PM is for not the threads, even the off topic though interesting stuff.

You don't seem to have an opinion beyond Russians bad..........

So what about that long list of lies you were caught at? How about an explanation for that? Was it deliberate, or maybe you just can't help it?

Jon post for yourself like the rest of us.......

Jon and Harry you should stop providing straw man arguments.Harry you should know getting off topic=Ban by now so stop trying to steer the discussion away from the topic, please. Thank you. This does not help anyone come to reason out this crisis. People have different opinions on things, this is very clear in Ukraine so stop trying to act like everyone is all happy with what is happening with their country Ukraine because that is a lie. Right sector is a terrorist group that arisen from maiden, that's not good. Don't have this old fashion cold war mindset. Oh and being a University student is hardly the child you wan't to make me out to be..thank you

It is not at all off topic to address claims Barney has made about events in Ukraine and to ask him to substantiate them.

you're being judged by your posts, not by your age, Szalawa. Creating some imaginary Slavic Empire or some Euro-Asian Empire, makes you sound pretty, darn childish. Besides, this is not about left or right either, it's about the right of Ukraine to exist as a free country, that's all.

Exactly. Let Ukraine be Ukraine. Russia has caused enough damage to every country it's had contact with.


I think we can take that as a firm 'no' about you explaining that long string of barefaced lies. At Primary School we used to say "liar, liar, pants on fire". Your pants must be a heap of ash by now.

agree 100%

The Eurasian Union is a real concept and stay on topic.


Ukraine is going to exist regardless if it losses some brake away provinces or not, Russia has plans for an Eurasian Union, why would they want a war, why not just attack Crimea with force and start full scale war? Let's see how the Ukrainian elections from now go, and then see if Ukraine is competent enough to solve it's problems through diplomacy then war against the people of the Donbass rep.

scroll up and look what I replied to and maybe....just maybe...you'll understand that I clearly replied to your post and if I'm off topic, then you must be too, don't you think? .....

btw. as you said, it's a concept and do you know what it means?

concept = an abstract idea

No,you talking about what I believe in is not the Ukrainian crisis.

this is what I replied to:

"Oh and being a University student is hardly the child you wan't to make me out to be..thank you"

how's that on topic, huh?

Blame Jon he took it to that and this is definitely getting off topic now.

Yes, let's get back to discussing events in Ukraine and what people say happened there. Barney:
you said that the Ukrainian Interior Minister, Arsen Avakov, founded the Ukrainian Nazi Party; you said that the current acting president of Ukraine stood in the 2010 presidential elections and got 1% of the vote; you said that special police units were sent to Odessa in response to the deaths there before the deaths happened; you said that the secretary of an advisory state body to the president of Ukraine is able to control the composition of the National Guard of Ukraine; you said that the secretary of an advisory state body to the president of Ukraine is in direct control of the security services, which are actually under the control of the Interior Minister; and you said that Neo-nazis are in control of the Armed Forces, National Security, Economy, Justice and Education ministries.

Are you ever going to address those lies?

Can you not post for yourself?

You launched the whataboutery hypocrisy campaign but refuse to discuss it yet act like a proxy and expect others to answer questions.

If you have a specific question I will answer it, you however have not answered any questions asked. For example where was the due process or resignation letter of the president? Or Why can you use whataboutery but others can't?

As you are acting as a proxy where is the proof for either conspiracy theory why are far right nationalists with Goebbels think tanks etc not neo nazis. Why is right sector which included an organisation called "white Hammer" not fascist. The list goes on.......

There are so many that have never been answered and I am still waiting for any of them to be answered.

Don't be silly Barney. Anyway, you lost all credibility (if you had any in the first place) by that long string of lies.

Are you going to explain why you told them?

And why you don't don't that Ukraine should be left alone by their bullying neighbour?

I see you don't like answering questions yet demand answers from others. I don't much value the opinion of self appointed elite "expats" on this forum there is no consistency in their opinions.

If you had been reading any posts in this thread I have made it clear several times that I do not think Russia should interfere in the internal affairs of Ukraine. That does not mean that I will sheepishly give unalloyed support for the new regime. I will not go along with the whitewash of the neo nazi aspects of this coup. I would like to see Ukraine in the EU but the transition will take years, the country is going to split and that is the fault of the Junta in Kiev.

The economic implications for the people will be incredibly difficult, the turbo charged neo con cowboys are going to screw that country.

(The link is in French but easy to read.)

Neo-nazis Barney? Would those be the same Neo-nazis you claim are in control of the armed forces, national security, economy, justice and education ministries? Or are those other people you're lying about, such as the acting president and the interior minister?

Why won't you address your lies Barney?

Exactly. He keeps trying to change the subject which is actually demeaning to the people in Ukraine, including people personally close to me, who had to live with the criminal Yanukovich and now have to deal with Russian stooges in black masks occupying their town hall.

And in this thread, the elephant in the room is that long list of lies. Why did you tell them, Barney?

One criminal out, another criminal in. Their all corrupt so Maidan was pointless. Lets hope the new elections would be better, someone who can represent all of Ukraine and is tolerant.

Again it is touching that you like to gossip without actually addressing any issues raised.

I have not tried to change the topic, the topic is Ukraine and the way you see it.

Today I asked you about your double standards re historical events and you refused to answer, the question of the legality of the removal of the president surfaced and again you refused to answer or provide evidence. You questioned the validity of the election but got the wrong one..... Not one single question has been answered not one single opinion has been offered ( bar one).

You really don't have an opinion on this (or anything else) other than a racist view that Russian = bad. It's a discussion board it's ok to give an opinion........

Barney, instead of giving your opinions about other posters, could you perhaps address the long and growing list of lies you have been caught telling about the situation in Ukraine?

It's almost comical the way the guy's trying to avoid explaining that long list of lies, even though it's meant he's lost all credibility and it's almost too late to redeem himself.