Coronavirus in Poland

Keep in mind that nobody can predict the future with certainty and that the scientific consensus about the virus changes thanks to more data and studies. There was a reasonable fear in summer 2020 that we might not be able to develop a vaccine at all since we failed to do so for previous Covid viruses. Then we had medical breakthroughs and developed a vaccine and hoped that we could go completely back to normal. However new mutations (thanks in part to people refusing to get vaccinated) destroyed this hope. Obviously politicians will have said different things at different times, but most of them will have done so in good conscience.

Sweet summer child....

In all likelihood, Corona, as with influenza and small pocks (among small children) will always be with us, unfortunately. However, we're told in the media that as of Spring '22, masks, social distancing etc. will no longer be mandatory in the US, possibly world wide. Vaccinations as well might well become voluntary, with emphasis instead of free, mandatory testing using the saliva test.

Wishful thinking perhaps, yet I tend to trust the NYT more than the White House on certain such matters!

Sweet summer child! I have some training in journalism (and have worked on newspapers). The NYT of today is an objectively terrible newspaper that fails to live up to minimal journalistic standards. Uncritical belief in what appears in it.... is not a good idea.

No newspaper or journal will be free from some degree of bias, Maf!
Don't forget, whatever Murdoch touches turns to dung:-)

.......people think their safer with the shot so they run their children to get the shot.
The Government has them so wound up and they don't check things out to get truth of what's really going on.
FEAR IS THE KEY...AND GOAL.
POPULATION CONTROL.
BUT WHO WANTS TO BELIEVE THAT !
Soon, very soon Dear LORD

Smallpox was largely eradicated due to vaccination.


Absolutely. Never trust 'libertarians', right-wingers or social conservatives. The interests they promote are theirs alone. Not yours, not mine, not ours, but theirs. The same is doubtless true about their approach to Covid.

True. Vaccines (properly tested) have been a great boon to mankind. Rushed medication.... is often not much of a boon (do the name thalidomide ring a bell?)

Covid vaccines are probably a good idea for at risk people, less so for less at risk people. The greater the risk the better an idea.

Vaccinating those who have already had the disease is.... deranged.

Nah, I reckon that you a are a bit deranged.

And vaccinating kids under 18 - a crime. Instead, we should prosecute the parents who let their kids get fat.

Because it's a rush and a pretty damn good achievement in that time. Research hasn't finished by any means and we are still in the earliest of days.


That medicine was far from rushed. It was however an example of private medicine at its worst. The company who made it even lied to its own sales reps. That's one of the reasons we have such strict controls now, and if anyone can competently 'rush' something, it is the (responsible and accountable) public health bodies who we trust to make decisions on medications and/or public health.


That of course depends on what the actual people responsible for (and accountable for) public health think.

Look, Maf, you're very intelligent and generally sensible. And you know as well as the best of us that nobody likes masks, nobody likes distancing, nobody likes having to do tests, get Covid passes or lose wages. Yet it's a grim fact of life right now, and moaning about the various approaches taken to help us get beyond this only stresses people. Some of whom have been affected (and are still being affected) the same or worse than you probably have been. Best not to sow despondency; that will change nothing.

@jon357

Agree with you 100% mate.
Maf is losing it and succumbing to the conspiracy theories that most Yanks seem to love.

...that people die. We are so freaked out about it that the ruling mob seized the moment and ruled that dying from covid after years of abusing yourself is now illegal.

In the gulag called Australia, 14 people die with covid every day, or 2% of the total of 700 daily deaths. To the Australian Gestapo, 2% of 700 from all other causes combined is unacceptable so they placed the country under house arrest.

The only reasonable explanation for this insanity is that the Australian ruling mob treats people as their property - aka "subjects".

BTW, the draconian measures NAZI would be too embarrassed to order did exactly nothing there and the "subjects" die now at the same rate as they did a year ago.


No, Milo. I detect in maf that good American distrust and healthy cynicism about governments and their apologists.

You, Euros, still think that the bums are your friends and protectors.

Notice what they are doing right now to know their game: by redefining "fully vaccinated," they can turn millions of double-jabbed people back into "unvaccinated" and stop them from becoming potential "breakthrough infections" and hurting the vaccine effectiveness stats. They will also be able to claim that people who die FROM the vaccines were not actually vaccinated. A brilliant satanic job.

They are constantly moving the goal post and I cant think of anyone who trusts them anymore. They have lost a lot of credibility in the US especially that Dr.Fauci or Fraudci is what ppl are calling him... He is in very big trouble now as Congress just caught him.

GOP calls for Fauci investigation, resignation mount after NIH admits funding gain-of-function research

That is bad but not as bad as the sheep that follow that goal post. At LA Fitness, less than half wear those idiotic masks that even doctors cannot justify if asked.

Rochelle Walensky, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, said Friday the U.S. "may need to update" its definition for what it means to have full vaccination against COVID.


Hats off to President Trump for making that happen at warp speed.

You didn't credit Biden for it. He wasn't president then but he thought about it.

A pandemic is not a game.

There is no "pandemic". Only 6% of the 700,000 died while healthy in the US. The world got fatter and less fit, and the fatsos - sicker with diabetes, high blood pressure, and heart problems. Instead of walking, we drive. Instead of going for a walk, we watch TV and eat pretzels.

There is a reason why Japan has such a low covid mortality rate.

And that is simply untrue. Decent 'double-jabbed' people are not 'unvaccinated'.

Of course but governments will define them as "not fully vaccinated".

Don't be surprised if they move the goalposts again in December and to fly or go to a movie you have to have got your booster shot.

As for "Don't moan and don't sow despondency". That is just an incredible belief - of course I am going to moan about something that stops me leading a normal life. You expect plastic smiles, patriotic songs and clapping like a 1950s Majowka ?

What I _really_ don't like is being lied to by the government. And you have to be deaf, dumb and blind to realize that there has been a massive amount of lies and other obfuscation around this from day one.

A small greatest hits...
-Chinese 'people collapsing in the streets' videos,
-Chinese obstruction of attempts to trace the origin,
-Fauci has admitted lying on two occasions supposedly for the public's own good (and flat out lied to congress),
-Doomsday scenarios from 'experts' that never really pan out,
-Flagrantly false reporting, especially about pediatric covid patients (like the case of the 14 year old in Canada),
-Politicians breaking rules (clearly they have never worried about this at all... why should I again?)
-Unmasked celebrities/politicians around masked servers (whose mask protects who? Do the math)

My limit was reached and passed very early on and now I don't believe what 'health experts' or government figures or journalists say about this. I believe the numbers (which is why that is what I post) and they tell a very different story for those who want to listen...


Not 'conspiracy theories' but 'the official story doesn't add up' theories. To believe the official story you have to empty your mind and simply parrot what the authorities of the moment happen to say (realizing that that can change.... pretty suddenly).

On the Lithuanian front:

twitter.com/gluboco/status/1451714806721957891

If your first reaction is "why doesn't he just get vaccinated?" then you would have accepted Martial Law in Poland "why not just stay home if that's what the government says?" or the Berlin Wall "Why not just get used to it? They don't shoot if you don't try to leave illegally..."

If this is centrally controlled, how long before governments simply turn your code from green to red because they don't like something you've written on line?

The Lithuanian governemnt :" There are no plans to get rid of the Covid certificate system, according to Gudlevičienė."

lrt.lt/en/news-in-english/19/1511997/lithuania-may-exclude-coronavirus-tests-from-national-covid-certificates

Day 81 (or 71 or 21)* of the fourth wave...

percent of positive test results: 14.0 % of 33,781 tests... increase continues... (about 17 percent in one voivodeship - lubelskie again)

hospitalization: +147 = 4706

intensive care: + 31 = 430

deaths: 13 (7with comorbidities) also 21 % of deaths were in a single voivodeship - lubelskie.... so this isn't distributed equally at all

from the previous day**: seven day moving average of daily deaths + 5= 46

Currently infected (how ever they happen to calculate that....) some bogus number over 208,000.... (which kind of throws a lot of the other numbers into doubt as well...)

*differing accounts of when the fourth wave began

**the source I use is a day behind and I'm too lazy to calculate on my own

As ever, thanks for the figures. It's disturbing to see the number of cases rising.


As far as I know, the government has been relatively straightforward about it.


'Centrally controlled' by whim?

That's because they only report their side the way they want people to take it as the gospel truth.
I mean just look at the vaccine propaganda that they are pushing to get children vaccinized/sterilized.

This is the disturbing part. Of course the last thing anybody wants is a new lockdown; nevertheless some restrictions this autumn are likely. If there are restrictions on cemetery visiting next week, that would be a huge warning sign, however this seems unlikely, and that whole weekend is likely to be a superspreader event.

Not from cemetery visits, it spreads through poorly ventilated indoor air (obvious for quite some time now).

And the 208,000 number is bogus, if you go by the government's own figures it's far less by any rational measure....

And all the kissing and hugging relatives and sneezing all over wreaths. Of course you've seen how tightly packed the crowds at Powązki and Bródno are, especially at Powązki. Plus crowded trains and buses, plus every half-decent zajazd packed with people scarfing down grochówka or kapuśniak and rarely-wiped tables.


Where did you get it from?

I heard that the police were out at certain metro station fining people today, however given the lack of social distancing and masks I saw yesterday in a couple of busy hotels and other places, it's not a surprise that cases are rising.