USA News and Poland - part 19

@Paulina
Tucker is no longer a true conservative.

@Bobko
A stretch? Interesting. It is 47 years since the Iran terrorists took the American embassy and US hostages. This is a country that lives "Death to America". It is their marching orders. Your Soviet sympathies are showing through. A snake only changes its skin to become a bigger snake. Time to cut the head off.

Ah, yes - the "No True Scotsman" fallacy (most likely). :)

Explain to the readers of this fine board PolAm:

1. What definition of conservatism are you using?
2. What specific conservative principles has Tucker abandoned?
3. Who gets to decide what counts as "true" conservatism, and by what authority?

@Torq
Please feel free to take a picture:

Conservatives believe in the "accumulated wisdom" of past generations, arguing that established customs and institutions such as family, church, and community are essential for social cohesion and stability.

They advocate for reducing the size and power of the federal government, preferring that power remains at local or state levels
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Conservatives champion individual freedom but emphasize that this freedom comes with personal responsibility for one's actions and welfare, rather than reliance on the state.

A strong adherence to established legal frameworks and order is prioritized to prevent chaos.

Protection of property and free enterprise is considered a cornerstone of liberty and prosperity.

Tucker does not support a strict reduction on government any longer. He seems to express that ICE has over reached, when they have not. Tucker has gotten caught up in his own ego, and no longer champions ideals as much as his thoughts on position.

Good enough? Or should we talk about constitutional rights? Maybe family values? Or how the feminist movement has destroyed the fabric of society in general? That of course would lead into a discussion of the exploding population of cats in feminist homes.

Two non-conservative retards spotted on this forum. They're not even real conservatives or American nationalists; they are, at best, grifters. Clueless people.
@BB
BB, you need to stop with the nonsense. For goodness' sake, man, listen: at some point, you incorrectly programmed your brain into thinking that terrorist organizations are somehow connected to Iran. Nothing could be further from the truth; these groups originate in Libya, Syria, Saudi Arabia, and Israel. Even Iraq has played a part in this.

Iran has a different culture, a different interpretation of Islam, and the majority of its people are of Indo-European origin, not Semitic Arabs. You've got it wrong, and you're obsessing over it. What happened-did someone promise you cheap oil from Iran, and you're still waiting? Come on, man, get a grip!

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Is not belllum iustum, legal, it depends on a legal system one adheres to.

It's funny you mention that phrase because I've been hearing it for decades. Since I was a kid, people have been saying it at work, on the streets, in bars, at family gatherings, on job sites, etc.... The only place you don't seem to hear it is on TV.


Speaking of retards. This entire forum is filled with European clowns with TDS.

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No. Not good enough. The conservatism that you advocate (limited government, free enterprise etc.) would seem to be of a Burkean kind.

So, I was right. It is a "No True Scotsman Fallacy":

1. True conservatists agree entirely with Burkean Conservatism.
2. Tucker doesn't seem to agree entirely with Burkean Conservatism.
3. So, Tucker isn't a true conservatist.

Also, you base point 2 of your "reasoning" on Tucker's criticism of ICE. Criticizing an agency for overreach is definitely not against conservatism. Conservatives have long warned against unchecked executive power, even when used for goals they support.


So what? Even if Tucker supports some forms of federal action that does not automatically disqualify him from conservatism. Many historical conservatives supported: tariffs (19th century Republicans), industrial policy (Hamiltonian tradition) or strong executive power in some contexts - and do you know why, PolAm? Because conservatism has always balanced order, sovereignty, and liberty. It has never been a pure libertarian doctrine of minimal state under all circumstances.


Aaah, who of us is not guilty of this sin sometimes? We are not, however, doing Tucker's personality assessment but trying to verify your statement that "he is no longer a true conservative" and, frankly, it doesn't hold water.

Tucker is an American patriot and a true America First supporter. What are you>?
@Joker

You are retarded grifter, what the F do you know? Why don't you move to Isreal?
Ah, you think the US saved Poland during WWII? LOL! You are so knowledgeable, I guess from catching glimpses of TV historical programs while you clean windows.
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@Torq
Some of those heretics should burn at the stake for their lunacy.

Tucker Carlson was fired and now just sounds bitter, same as disgraced Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger. Most Americans aren't paying attention to them anymore. Maybe Europeans that dont have anything better to do are. At this point, Tucker's been reduced to YouTube clips and podcast rants.


That's not an argument, it's a meltdown with spelling errors. When someone jumps straight to insults and move to Israel, it usually means they've run out of ideas and are flailing. Hahahahaha


You had to invent a job just to insult me. That's Lazarus level stupidity. I'll compare apples and oranges with you anytime, moneybags.


I said Europe, not just Poland. Try reading before you start spewing your big fat mouth off!

@Torq
Excuse maker for Tucker. You be who you want to be.

@Ironside
Tucker is a partiot. Never said he wasnt. But he is not a true conservative. Understand the difference? Or do we need another remedial learning session?

Agreed. Netanyahu has spent the last three decades spouting how much of a threat Iran is without any evidence to support it. This is Iraq all over again and Israel's puppet Trump is dragging everyone else into a war that nobody wants.

Just heard Trump slagging off Starmer/UK for being uncooperative over UK bases, and now he's cutting off all trade with Spain because Madrid is refusing to let the US use jointly owned bases. US and Israel start a war and expect everyone to do their bidding. My feelings are that they can fvck off.

Nothing has been properly thought through, there's no real plan, and Trump doesn't give a sh!t about the Iranian people. I'd like to see his reaction if Iran had bombed a school in the US, but Iranian women and children clearly don't matter. Hell, he didn't give too much of a sh!t about the US servicemen that have been killed.


That didn't come as too much of a surprise given that the US has always been Israel's puppet.


Not true but I think you MAGA types would rather gouge out your own eyes than ever admit that your Nero makes grave mistakes. You all keep spouting the party line.

You always sound sour and bitter while posting here. It has been years. Does that mean you were fired years ago and remain unemployed? Do you imagine you are making some kind of argument?

You post nothing but insults. When will you share a real argument of your own instead of repeating propaganda slogans from TV? Come on, Buster, contribute something of value-an actual argument instead of just the nonsense about Europe. An ignorant person like you should know his place.

What do I care about Europe? Go to a French forum or some such and show off there; your meltdowns and limited vocabulary do not impress us.

Do you understand? Neo-cons are not really conservatives; true conservatives hardly exist anymore, except for maybe one or two odd individuals. I'm saying that Tucker is a patriot who supports America first, while you seem to support Israel first. Do you get the difference, or do you need a clearer example of what it means to be an American patriot?

That's exactly what I said here... https://polishforums.com/off-topic/poland-usa-news-part-89132/6/#msg2059228

Great minds think alike, Iron! :)


This is your response to #216? Disappointing.


This is a fallacy, as I have demonstrated. You could - at best - argue (with difficulty) that he is not fully Burkean in his conservatism, but nothing more.

Damn... this war is gathering momentum quickly!

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When Chirac and Schroeder refused to support the Iraq War, Bush tried also to punish France and Germany.

These were the times of "Freedom Fries", but also it ended up working to the benefit of Poland and the Baltics (and Ukraine and Georgia).

Upset with the French and Germans, Rumsfeld and Rice would go around talking about "Old Europe" and "New Europe" - and America ended up shifting a lot of its focus onto the UK and Eastern Europe.

But Bush never:

1) Applied sanctions against France and Germany

2) Never threatened to unilaterally use French or German military bases without asking for permission.

3) Never threatened to "cut them off from all trade".

Trump is doing some next-level sh*t with Spain...

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I don't see how it's possible for him to do anything against Spain with regards to trade? Isn't all Spanish trade policy decided in Brussels?

Does that mean Trump will punish the entire EU for Spain's resistance?

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Finally - I suspect Trump is doing exactly what Pedro Sanchez wanted him to do anyway.

This guy's gonna get a big electoral boost from picking a fight with Trump.

There is nothing as refreshing as someone cutting straight through the sh1t to the correct answer.

This is totally true, a true conservative is something to behold. Someone who will go up on a cross to make a point often about personal or religious freedom. They are not looking fame or fortune, It really is a marvel. I've seen good old lefties and old fashioned conservatives argue the same thing from different positions, they are leaders. These newfangled neo cons or Maga crowd are followers.

@Bobko
He can't sanction Spain has to do the whole EU or nothing.

Sanchez will get a bounce. Starmer trying to appease Trump has backfired big time

those two two unexplained train crashes in Spain in quick succession were no accident. That was Bibi Payback for Spain's stance on Gaza as well as a warning on further non-conformity.

The Epstein files and Trump's actions have led many to realise that left and right is just a ploy to divide us while the 0.1% fund and control both and rule the world with impunity.

just wow..

US military commanders have been invoking extremist Christian rhetoric about biblical "end times" to justify involvement in the Iran war to troops, according to complaints made to a watchdog group.

Ironside, you're not even American, yet you keep lecturing Americans about patriotism and conservatism. That's pretty funny. Three paragraphs of insults and still no actual argument. Maybe focus on Poland instead of pretending you understand American politics.

So now train crashes in Spain are Mossad revenge plots and a secret 0.1% cabal controls everything. This is what terminal TDS looks like. At some point you stop discussing politics and start writing wild conspicary theories. Get a grip already!

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always dig the ancient times.


You still don't get it yankee doodle, it's nothing to do with pedo Trump or Kamalala or Demrats or Repubpigs.

Clowns and morons, impressed by a little testosterone and loud talk, voted for Trump and kept supporting him. They didn't realize he was already owned. It's like marrying someone with a truckload of baggage after one month.

Trump's goals have never changed:

1. Make himself and his buddies richer.
2. Toss crumbs to the "loyal" fans.
3. Keep his dirty secrets buried deep.

#3 matters the most. If that fails, everything else falls apart. His handlers - who know the secrets - know it, which is why they keep both Trump and America on a short leash. Meanwhile, the rest of us get to live with the mess. But hey, at least they owned the libs - what a bargain.

The "Irish" woman says:

Megyn Kelly:

No one should have to die for a foreign country. I don't think those service members died for the United States.

Our government's job is not to look out for Iran or Israel. It's to look out for us.

This war is clearly Israel's war.

x.com/clashreport/status/2028941015541801023

So your whole argument is that Trump is secretly controlled by mysterious "handlers" with dirt on him. That's not an argument, that's just delusional conspiracy rambling. Do you ever bring evidence, or just more dramatic TDS hate filled stories?

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What happens when you listen to the neocons, they finally got their war that they so desperately wanted while the Trump administration is "finito" after Saturday.

Democrats are back in the saddle first after the midterms and then in the white house, globohomo triumphs, MAGA no longer exists.

but at least Donald bought himself some time before the video is published of the little girl he was nailing together with Epstein

and what is best, the Jews will wash their hands of him as if Trump has not owed them anything

Trump is the worst thing that could happen to the Alt-right movement in America, he will destroy it perhaps irreversibly.

And just like that the US took out the group picking the new leader and the alleged new leader. Keep going until someone decent is appointed.

too few of these guys left ie real patriots not a bunch of govfags on the take. Or on the blackmailed list

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@amiga500

Thomas Massie - a thoroughly decent fellow and a true American patriot (not like some of the Trump's pinworms here).


Hear, hear.

Why are people trying to look for some complicated, mysterious motivations for this war when the most obvious explanation is that Trump a) wanted a distraction from his difficult domestic situation and b) had trapped himself into a position from which he could not back off from without losing his face?

Trump is hardly the first leader who starts a poorly-planned war due to those reasons.

I don't lecture Americans:
a, I write, do not speak here. You can call it a presentation or a lesson. ( Shame on me, I'm teaching Americans English. How dare I? He had it coming.)
b, Not all Americans, but some American peasants like yourself need it.
c, It is not an argument buster; it is deflection and a lame one at that.
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No arguments? Really?, You might be sad to realize that you don't understand what you read. There are plenty of arguments all over this forum posted by me, not necessarily in the posts directed to you, but they are easy to find. Yet, you never address them head-on. Instead, you spread lies and nonsense.
Pathetic.

Ok fine, but so what? They are not a threat to the US and won't be in the foreseeable future. All that has happened due to the US meddling in Iranian affairs is not the other way around. Even now, the US supports an unjustified war of aggression against Iran on behalf of Israel.
So, naturally, the question arises: are you okay with American taxpayers and American soldiers being spent in the war that benefits Israel's imperial ambitions?

Phew, he is what was needed to get rid of all those fake conservatives and fake American patriots. Now it's the America Firsters time. But the old Republican party is done; they don't know it yet.