Coronavirus in Poland

Dude you have a big problem with that. We all know it. Call it obsession and leave at that. All leftie parties be in Europe be in USA are doing more or less the same in regard to covid.

Rather then list BS of one or other gov it would be much more interesting to look for a common denominator and some patters and reasons in an overal approach to the problem worldwide.

Well I _live_ in Poland so that's the most relevant to me.


The Chinese Communist Party has exported its style of rule as part of its pursuit of soft political power. Other governments, more or less economically dependent upon Chinese goodwill, have agreed to follow Chinese style policies....

The idea of populations just meekly accepting arbitrary government decrees (like lockdowns, masks, etc) without any legitimate force of law is now well-established in dozens of formerly free countries.

Expect more.

Can anyone British or Irish explain what the EU wanted to do with the Irish border during the recent vaccine contretemps?

Apparently Ursula has a long record of wrecking things so it's no surprise her vaccine buying program was.... a lot less optimal than the UK's, but why drag Ireland into it?

@mafketis
She is a failed politician that should never have risen so high.
But hey, that's how The EU works, they reward failure.
To answer your question, this hypocryte was prepared to impose a hard border on the island of Ireland to protect The EU's supply of vaccine.

Despite the fact that in her negotiations with The UK on the Brexit deal she said that the protection of the free border in Ireland was sacrosant.

She is an absolute waste of time and if you look at her career history, she has been a huge failure.....
This is one reason why I believe that The EU will fall eventually.... just a question of time.....

AstraZeneca got caught red-handed exporting vaccines from Belgium to the UK, probably because the UK was either paying more, or it was in the contract with AZ that they would have first dibs on produced vaccines.

So, the EU wanted to impose customs controls on the Irish border in order to prevent trucks from exporting to the UK that way. It was a huge faux pas, because there was no need for it - they could simply check trucks arriving in Ireland at the ports and leave the Irish border alone. They very quickly went back on the idea, but there were good intentions there in terms of looking after EU citizens.


That's largely the old West-East issue, plus political moves by France to blame. The poorer EU countries didn't want to commit to buying huge stocks of more expensive vaccines when AZ and others promised huge amounts of cheap vaccines, while the French also made some demands because they've got their own vaccine in development that they naturally want to sell instead.

I have to say that I don't think the common vaccine purchase was a good idea at all. I understand why it was done (bulk buying power and the power of negotiating as a bloc), but the amount of compromises that had to be made has resulted in this situation.

Seven times as much, apparently.

Please prove that outrageous statement with a credible link.....

The AZ vaccine is being supplied at cost price, so they are not making a profit, unlike Pfizer.......


But not good intentions in terms of looking after British or Irish citizens. ... the hypocrisy is just unbelievable!!

No.The EU showed themselves up for what they really are, with this incident.
A self serving bunch of nationalistic hypocrytes!

CNN more or less say it here - if you read between the lines, they're being careful not to say it outright, but they're hinting heavily about it.

cnn.com/2021/01/30/europe/uk-eu-astrazeneca-vaccine-nationalism-gbr-intl/index.html

Don't get me wrong - it seems that the issue is that the EU hadn't taken into account that Oxford almost certainly insisted on the UK being supplied first.

But you're right, this very much showed that both sides are entrenched. The poorer EU countries are relying on the AZ vaccine, while the richer ones know that they're in serious danger of taking the blame for the slow rollout.

It's an ugly fight, not helped by AZ rather idiotically promising to supply the EU from the UK factories.

You got out. Why EU should look after Brits?

Why should the EU try to shove its way in line ahead of a country that was faster to make a deal and get contracts signed?

The UK got in fast and made a deal while the slow, cumbersome EU set up a bunch of mechanisms and an unwieldy and unworkable system.

The nation-state is the logical unit for setting vaccine policy with maybe some financial help for the poor countries.

AZ has a sub brand "Covishield" which is manufactured in India and is sold at a very cheap price outside the EU.

Possible but the EU did it to protect EU citizens and moaning that it wasn't good for Brits is childish.

Plus, as far as I know it wasn't about the negotiated speed of delivery but about delays?

We are not in Africa either but does that mean we do not help when people there are starving?

There is no question, the EU have messed up big time and some heads will roll.

Germany, France and NL tried to go it alone on procuring vaccines and then did a u turn "for the sake of the EU".

Hungary was having none of it.

This whole saga has shown up everything that is wrong with the EU.

UK was the fastest in rolling their program. Why didn't they offer to help EU when their vaccine was delayed? Or is your definition of help helping those ahead?

They have discussed helping Ireland.

Yes, but only after they announced it without consulting the governments of the Republic or Northern Ireland beforehand. When it was announced, there was a hue and cry on both sides of the border, the Irish government spoke to the EU Commission nd that's what put a stop to it. In fairness to Her Nibs, she's new to the job and it's very rare for anybody outside Ireland to truly understand Irish politics and the border issue.

The main delay was caused by the EU dragging it's feet.

Johnson is desperate to succeed at something. He's failed in every other aspect of his premiership, 100,000 people have died of covid under his watch. He's also in a delicate position politically regarding the status and future of the NHS. Fast vaccine rollout is a make or break situation for him politically, hence the way he's behaved over this.


Payola and huge political pressure.

What a surprise of a text from the Daily Torygraph.

From Rolls Royce to Skoda: How the pandemic has exposed Britain's failed 'regulatory state'

As the UK death toll passes 100,000, we examine how our hollowed-out state not only broke down but failed to plan to stop a pandemic

By Lee Jones
26 January 2021 · 10:01pm

telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/rolls-royce-skoda-pandemic-has-exposed-britains-failed-regulatory/

Even the right-wing no longer defend the right-wing. Since their actions are indefensible.

If one good thing comes out of this crisis, it's the Overton Window correcting itself and shifting away from its recent drift rightwards.

O.k. all you fatso's.........
Obese people diagnosed with Covid-19 were more than twice as likely to be hospitalized, 74% more likely to need an intensive care unit and 48% more likely to die, according to a study from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill," per the Washington Post.

Research has also linked obesity to lower responses to numerous vaccines.

Meanwhile the great Russian jab is said to be 91% effective. Yet no one is buying it in Europe? If something works, wouldn't a government be derelict in its duty if it didnt buy what is working? Put political beliefs aside for a moment and ask why every country hasn't bought that vaccine.

Nobody trusts the Russians....simple.....

@Miloslaw
And it was not the Russians who studied their vaccine it was an independent body. Anyone paranoid enough to think Russia would get away with selling a vaccinee to wipe out the planet needs to seek medical intervention and take the tin foil off the head.

Politics and keeping Putin from looking good internationally is the only thing that could be stopping purchases. So who is really caring for their citizens if there is an option available and its not at least explored?

Hungarians have bought Sputnik V, and Germany is supporting it being approved by the EMA in the future. Anyway it seems that due to the relative weakness of the AstraZeneca vaccine, studies are underway to combine it with Sputnik V (First shot of Astra and then second shot of Sputnik V)

In other news seems like Ivermectin really works both as prophylactic, outpatient and in hospital. Heaps of RCT trials in third world countries and good observational studies in states in India and Peru where the death rate plummeted. In Europe Slovakia and Macedonia have already approved it for Sars-Cov2. Funny how there is a media blackout about it. covid19criticalcare.com/

This has been known for quite some time... but pharmaceuticals don't stand to profit much from it so..... who cares? Not the media.

Quality control is not a strong point there, and there's a general reluctance to trade with them for obvious reasons.

There's one other problem: the Russians haven't submitted it for approval.

@delphiandomine
The Russians offered it to the world months ago. Pretty easy to request some and have it tested out. If it needs approval, that's not on Russia, that is on the EU. Russia approved it for their own people, and look how well they are rioting in the streets. Very healthy looking as the clubs come down on their heads.

The numbers of this virus are simply not adding up to the world wide panic and insane lockdowns. The Polish Health Minister is nothing but a panic monger and actually said his decisions were based on what is happening in the USA! He said this publicly. The Social and Economic life in Poland is nothing close to the US. Even the US in most cases is now seeing business open at least partially. This guy is worse than the thieving last guy!

They don't anywhere, it's not about health policy it's about normalizing Chinese Communist Party rule through the adoption of Chinese policies.


Szumowski had his faults but he was a column of competence next to the current idiot....