Poland under pressure of EU to accept more asylum seeking refugees

Everybody's got a story, but anecdotal evidence is not what policy should be built upon, rather hard (often unpleasant) numbers. And the numbers point to disproportionate unemployment and economic underachievement among UK muslims.

And... these were both muslim men marrying non-muslim women, ask these great guys what would happen if their sisters took up with charming catholic guys from Nottingham.....

Doug I am not sure what point you are making. You had a couple of Muslim friends when you were a student?
What does that have to do with anything? Lots of us have Muslim friends, it doesnt make us heroes.
Personal anecdotes are all very interesting but dont really have much to do with the bigger picture.

Dougpo I too have had many good friends in the UK who were of a different religion or race I think that the UK is one of the better if not the best example of multiculturalism in Europe today.

From what I see here is the Polish people reject multiculturalism and do not want this to happen in Poland, the recent elections have proved that.

I think this is why the government is rejecting wholesale migration into Poland.

Very true. Just that...that's what I miss, different peoples, and the biggest racists when I spend time in Britain with comments like "Look at those Asians...." are Eastern Europeans. And I do mean Poles.

This thread is about :

a. What should we be doing to aid the refugees?
b. What kind of a country Poles want.

I was suggesting that the UK is a diverse culture, and richer for it, what with my local shopkeeper being Asian, my taxi-driver being Nigerian, my domino partners being Jamaican.

Poland is poor by comparison, and they should have some refugees here to brighten the place up a bit:)


They rejected any giving. They need to get back to that church and prostate themselves before their maker for they have sinned......

No - really, nobody's talking about Poland becoming anything other than 98 per cent Polish. 10,000 nig-nogs wont change that.

well yes it is, but you know there are an awful lot of e'g' white North Londoners who go on about this as something really 'desirable' and 'cool' yet they would never invite one of those people into their house, they are just a kind of interesting background feature. Know what I mean?

sorry I digress.

INNATE GERMAN ARROGANCE?
Poland's new interior minister Mariusz Błaszczak has accused EP chairman Martin Schulz of "German arrogance" and recalled Nazi atrocities in Warsaw in reaction to Schulz's criticism of Warsaw's reluctance to accept EU refugee quotas. The German claimed any refusal to accept people fleeing the Middle East and North Africa showed a lack of European "solidarity". Of all people, Germans should not criticise Poland after killing tens of thousands of Poles during World War Two, Błaszczak said. "Schulz's words are an example of German arrogance," he added.

It seems unabated arrogance is an innate German characteristic. They once ponificated on who was subhuman and superhuman, now they are lecturing others on solidarity.

uk.reuters.com/article/2015/11/17/us-europe-migrants-poland-schulz-idUKKCN0T61RK20151117

PiS has the diplomatic skills of Ghengis Ghan. They will make Poland the laughing stock of Europe just as they did under Pres. Lech.

And you are actually PROUD of this xenophobia Polonius? Do you know the meaning of the word "phobia", as in "an irrational and often-harmful fear of some norm..?"

How very odd. You seem to enjoy Poles being sneered at and commented about as to their intelligence by other nations.

I don't. My daughter is Polish. But thankfully normal, with no ridiculous and (illegal) phobias.

Don't you do that now?

I do not understand Europe's obsession to force Poland to take migrants en mass, Poland does not have the infrastructure to accept them, Hospitals, Schools, Social services do not even have translation services available, where I live still very few professionals speak English, which you may expect to be a common ground.

There are already well trodden routes for settlement for people, look at England for example, Bradford (Muslim Pakistani), Leicester (Hindu Sikh), South London (Africa, south asia) these towns have plenty of people who can converse with and support immigration, official documents are available in multiple languages, most government departments have people who can readily translate for people. Traditional / religiose food is readily available for them

I don't think Europe is being fair to the migrants, and is using them for political reasons, surely they would be happier and better off in the UK,Germany and france

Do you believe foreign multi-culti buffs, eurocrats, arrogant German officials, Western leftstream media or loudmouth, know-all Pole-bashing expats have the right to determine what kind of country Poles want? Or should the Polish response be: STFU?

Seeing that the Polish government wishes to play the WWII card, perhaps we should point out the millions of Polish migrants which the world was expected to take in during and after WWII? Let's not forget about the tens thousands of Polish migrants who were welcomed in the near east back then.


Remind us which citizenship you choose to have before you complain about expats.

And I'm sure that they don't want to come in Poland either, and they won't stay here if they're sent (they've already proven how little they care about things like respecting laws and borders....

It's all status wh*ring, people showing how progressive they are by writing checks they know won't be cashed (and a way for Merkel to try to save some face from the most disastrous political miscalculation in the EUs history).

Germans, French, English, Spanish,... they all have colonial past. They greatly enjoyed in slavery. They themselves formed as nations from the antic or medieval city states, from unique cultures and languages that emerged there and then they spread Romanizing, Germanizing and Alglicanizing natives, in violent and peaceful means thru killing or by economic and social incentives. Their main victims, native Slavs or native Americans. So, essentially, German, French, English, Spanish,... are cultures that represent mix of cultures. So for them, what does it matter if add and assimilate some new culture in their conglomerates. Nothing, it means nothing to them. So they have false racism, false democracy and they have false multiculturalism. Everything is false in them. All is there when needed and everything is sometimes needed for the final result, which is rule and domination of few rich families and magnates.

Polish case is different. Poles are people. Native people. Poles don`t have colonial past. It was abominable to ancestors of Poles to take freedom from other peoples. Ancestors of Poles never took slaves. They never grabbed foreign land. Polish hospitality even in ancient past was equal as today`s so called multiculturalism, invented by Germans, French, English, Spanish,... Democracy? Even in times immemorial Poles ruled themselves by standards higher then today`s democratic standards of western Europe. Polish racism? See, that is the problem. Problem? Sure, by standards of western Europe. Poles are honest people. Well, far more then English, just for example. Poles are hospitable. Sincerely hospitable. Poles also know democracy. Better then western Europeans. But, if one try to overrun Poland, to grab Polish land so that its not Polish anymore but who knows whom, Poles then react. As true native culture, Poles are attached to their their land. Its not healthy to try to tell them that Poland isn`t first Polish land and just then temporary shelter for guests that enjoy in Polish hospitality.

Poland accepted some 90,000 Chechen refugees during Russia's crackdown on that country but now only a handful remain. So it will surely be with the current crop. If Poland does accept 7,000, within a year that figure is likely to dwindle down to a few hundred.

7,000 is not "en-masse" by any stretch of the imagination. And yes, there are Syrians here in Gdynia, buying and selling, and working in the Hala, so some would stay I am sure. And those people seem settled. Annoyingly, when I hear them talking, their Polish is generally better than mine :(

Dougpo "millions of Polish migrants which the world was expected to take in during and after WWII?"

This is one point that I and many poles like me would disagree with

Poland was sold into slavery ad part of the Yalta agreement, my father and many others serving in allied forces were EXILED , I too had lived in exile, our legitimate government in London was replaced by Soviet traitor scum in Poland (No western power stood for us), We Poles would have gladly gone back to Poland (With arms) and continued the struggle from within, at anytime during the soviet occupation and if called upon I would have returned to join a armed struggle for freedom.

But I am glad that we are free at last, without the resultant bloodshed that a armed struggle would have caused.

Maybe it is with this history and passion for Poland, Our government has offered the opportunity for migrants to re take their homelands.

If I had been offered the opportunity in Britain to Join a free Polish force, while I was in Exile , I would have taken it full stop no question.

Polish dominions spread to the black Sea in the 1300s as you will know. Do you seriously believe they were welcomed with open arms? Nope, they took it by negotiation or by force.

Tell that to the Lithuanians, the Czechs, the Slovaks, the Ukrainians, the Germans, etc. All of those invasions and occupations produced refugees.


Who was stopping you from doing that?

I couldn't agree more with your post up to this point, where the sick Roosevelt caved in to Stalin's demands at Yalta, and your patriotism in wanting to fight for your homeland. I too, at 58, would stand in the trenches for the country of my birth. But what do you mean by the above statement?

There is too much about "Syrians don't stand and fight.." Give them the arms to defeat Assad, and they would. Otherwise they are simply cannon fodder aka Aleppo and Homs. So in the meantime, they are here in Europe. Not good. Let us hope they too, like you, get to go home:)

dougpo to answer your question (I don't usually like quoting from the newspapers) I am refer to the statement below.

Poland's foreign minister proposes forming army out of the Syrian men arriving in Europe

Mmm... Now you are being contentious Harry. We know that any true Polonia force would have been impounded by the conservative British army and refused carriage.

The sad truth was that Polonia was shattered and the sensible Polish refugees made a good lives for themselves in their adopted countries, and those who wished got to retire to Poland as a happy ending.

They don't seem to appreciate that the happy ending for this wave of refugees is nowhere in sight, and at this moment a hell of a lot of them are standing knee deep in mud in some Balkan field. It's nice and warm where I am, and the SAD lamp is burning bright, but I don't feel good about the situation at all.


Right. So why didn't the Poles and others arm the Syrian resistance when they were begging for help in Homs? Now they are here in Europe of course, the good old minister is suddenly concerned.

Moron. (the minister in question (obviously!)

Harry: what stopped us was the zero support that we got from our host countries who were busy parading their glory with Stalin.

Harry Don't worry I am also British I would do the same for Britain.

I tried to Join then navy via their scholarship scheme, my problem was that i was told that because I still had family in Poland (Still iron curtain) I would not be able to rise above junior corporal, and access to certain strategic roles would be limited.

but its entirely different case then western European domination and spreading. All around the Polani were other Slavs (ie Sarmatians). It was tribal competition in which Polani (later Poles) were most successful. They have my blessing for all they done. Their only failure is that didn`t achieve more.


What to tell them? Polani were most successful. It was their moment. But, Poles still have time to influence realm of their glorious ancestors. Sure, in past it was tribal domination. Now would be Intermarium. i sincerely hope that would we Serbians play positive role in spreading Polish influence. As my grandmother said: ``What does it matter if we Serbians don`t dominate, as long as some other Sarmats dominate Sarmatian realm.`` In our time, turn again come to Poles to give influence, to dominate, if you want. Why should i be selfish or live in complexes because of that? Poles are true Sarmats. So i salute incoming Polish era

Doug , Harry , please understand I too do not want people stuck in fields across the muddy fields of Europe, There are countries in Europe who are geared up and able to take them out of the fields today. why are you just pointing your fingers at Poland, you guys live in Poland, you and I know it will not be the best experience for them here,

We must stop the pity guilt trips and face reality for a start.


Yup and as Polish refugees they respected their host country and acclimated to it willingly by accepting it's culture.
That is the difference between then and now.
The refugees of today have no desire to learn the language of the host country, abide by it's laws and DEMAND that they be treated with benefits that they have not worked for.

Their mission is to turn their host countries culture into the culture of the country that they came from.
BIG difference and you wonder why no one wants them, not even other Muslim countries of similar culture.

You're right Dougpol1. Your experience with your two friends proves your point and challenges the veracity of everyone who has an opinion different to yours. I mean, really ?? You might be able to string a few sentences together but please let me know when you actually say something of intellectual merit as I might miss it.


And what does this prove exactly ?


Is there really any need for that ? You don't know me so have no idea what I am worth. This may be a public forum but there are rules.....


Did they have children. Were they baptised ? Did she continue to practise her faith after being married. No need to answer........


I have done and it doesn't look good for your argument.

You know what Dougpol1. I don't actually enjoy this type of online preening. You don't know me and equally I don't know. You're probably a good guy who just expresses himself a certain way.

All of us are the sum totals of our environment and experience. I live in the UK in an area where there are many muslim communities. I consider myself to genuinely be one of the nicest people I know  and a few years ago I would cringe whenever I heard people speaking in derogatory terms about anyone from a different race. I am the son of Polish immigrants and they didn't have it easy when they first came to England so that compassion was breathed into me from an early age.

The first wave of Pakistani and Bangladeshi immigrants actually integrated better than the third and fourth generation people we see here today. The burka and niqab were nowhere to be seen in the 1960's.

However, experience has slowly changed and hardened my attitude. Muslims initially want to be free to be muslims in the UK but it doesn't stop there. Muslim lobby groups then try to pressure local councils, MP's and commercial enterprises to change for their benefit and ONLY for their benefit. So now we have a national eatery chain that not only sells only Halal meat in their sandwiches but has also banned pork and bacon in their stores. As a Christian, I would like to eat something that hasn't been blessed in the name of a muslim god but I'd settle for eating something that hasn't been blessed in the name of any god..........as it has been for the last century !!

We had a scenario where major supermarket chains were selling Halal meat without marking it as Halal and it was only due to media coverage they felt obliged to clearly mark and inform their customers.

Local councils are abusing their powers to grant planning permission to Muslim community centres. These community centres' real ambition is to be a mosque but they know they won't always get planning permission straight away so they apply for a "community centre with a prayer room". After a few years they apply for an amendment to the original application that would allow them to accommodate more worshippers and to operate from sun rise to sun down. Now these hours in the summer months can mean over twelve hours of operational use and these centres are usually wedged right smack in the middle of residential streets. Residents concerns are usually overlooked however which does nothing for community relations.

I do agree with you that Poles are racist but I'm going to move the argument to a different level and ask the question, "is it wrong to be racist" ? I don't mean it's acceptable to treat another human person worse than we would treat our own countrymen but is it wrong to want your own country to have people who share the same history, language, food, culture and traditions as yourself ?

Multiculturalism is not something Poland should be aspiring to and even in the UK there is a growing school of thought that the multiculturalism experiment has failed to deliver on it's promises. It does not create a "richer" society it only creates a society that is more divided. There is one important caveat in that I believe the failure is largely associated with muslims. Blacks, Chinese, Indians etc have all integrated far better.

As a side note regarding your comment about Poles being racist I have personally found many English people to be more racist towards Poles than to people with darker skin tones. It's not relevant to this discussion but an interesting observation all the same.

Your summary of what this thread is about is accurate

A what should we be doing to help the refugees
B what kind of country Poles want

B-I have tried to answer this question and hope I have provided some food for thought on anyone wrestling with this question
A-Perhaps Poland should accept a limited number of refugees but only on one strict condition-that people are positively identified as genuine refugees and not economic migrants.

Question A in some ways is irrelevant and hypothetical as the refugees and migrants do not want to come to Poland and would only do so if they had no choice and even then they would move to a more preferable country once the opportunity arises.

YOU chose these people as your friends, it was YOUR choice. You are insisting that Polish people "have"to accept strangers that have been foisted on them by unelected politicians who will never be expected to live among them. Why should the Poles have to put up with the call to prayers, five times a day?. Why should Polish children be deprived of the chance to appear in the Christmas nativity play because it might offend fellow pupils who practice the religion of peace?

This poem comes to mind:-

The Stranger within my gate,
He may be true or kind,
But he does not talk my talk--
I cannot feel his mind.
I see the face and the eyes and the mouth,
But not the soul behind.

The men of my own stock,
They may do ill or well,
But they tell the lies I am wanted to,
They are used to the lies I tell;
And we do not need interpreters
When we go to buy or sell.

The Stranger within my gates,
He may be evil or good,
But I cannot tell what powers control--
... cropped

Very Well Said!

I have to say I agree with Spiritus and Avalon, There are plenty of multi cultural countries available for people who want that to live that way, there is no need for a crusade to turn Poland into another one. I see no need.